China Romance
General Discussion and Useful Links => Ask An Experienced Member => Topic started by: wilsbrough on October 16, 2009, 02:08:09 pm
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Hi guys, i have a big dilemma. But i will tell my story 1st. I went to China this year to meet a lady who i thought was 'the one'. We got on very well thru the emf's, but never had any real direct contact before i went, All her pictures she sent came thru the Chnlove website, and when i arrived in China, if it was not for the fact that the translator called out my name, i would have walked right past her, as she looked nothing like the pictures she had sent.. Also she was supposed to have reasonable English skills, but turned out that they were very, very basic. There was other discrepancies with her interests to and to be honest i felt like i had been deceived! Not the best way to begin a loving lasting relationship right?
Then on my return, i started writing to another girl for about 3 months, about a week after getting off the emf's she said she saw me as more of a brother, and i have sent direct emails to her after this, but i have never got a reply since...
I have now been writing to a lady who seems very nice, (only for about 1 month now but we write emf's everyday) we have similar interests, in music, hobbies etc. She told me hers 1st, so i know these are genuine and she was not just saying she likes the same things as me to seem more compatible. She has sent me pictures, that are of her in everyday situations and on her holidays, but again thru Chnlove. I have told her of my past experiences, and said that i felt badly deceived by these two other girls, and before i commit to coming to China again i really would like at least one webcam chat with her. She says she has no computer at home, but uses her work computer to write and send me replies, via her agency, and this is how she gets my mails, so she must have a direct email right? I have given her mine, but she has not given me hers, i have mentioned QQ and she uses this at work with her clients. I have mentioned i could phone her, but she has not given me her cell number. So after telling her my past bad experiences and said we know of some bad agencies who send emails without the girl knowing and of the 'photoshopping' that can occur. This is part of her last reply
''Your description in these letters did scare me a lot, l don't know what to say already............ Anyhow, l have to be frank with you that l firmly believe that trust is the most essential and important basics in building and strengthening any relationships, no matter how much terrible life experience you've been experienced before, and how many hurt you've been got, so l have nothing to say if you don't trust me. As it's the most radical factor to strengthen our relationship, but it can't be satisfied with, so did it prove we're not as suitable to each other we supposed so originally?
l've never have the webcam to chat with anyone, and will refuse all the similar requests no matter face to anyone, l don't want to see anything strange thru the webcam, and don't want to prove myself in this way. As l told you before that l will just chat with my clients thru the QQ during the business hours so as to keep well in touch with them for business needed, l never do it in my sparetime, instead l prefer to call my friends out for fun and chat face to face, that's me! See?
l've been thought that maybe l can try and give you a surprise maybe, but l do hope you can get to know me much better, l'm a very pure girl that have never had the simlilar experience like you have, and your request did bring me a lot of pressure, l hate to be forced to do something l don't like to most, to be candid''
So, i do not know what to do, what do my brothers think of this? Do you think that all pictures that come thru Chnlove are photshopped? I do like this girl, but after my experiences i find it hard just to trust someone without direct contact just because she asks me to. A phrase comes to mind, 'Trust can not be given just by someones words, but their actions too' I do not want to be put thru the Chnlove ringer a third time, but if she is who she says she is, what if i'm blowing my chances on someone who could well be my soulmate?
Please any advise will be appreciated, thanks.
Andy....
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l've never have the webcam to chat with anyone, and will refuse all the similar requests no matter face to anyone, l don't want to see anything strange thru the webcam, and don't want to prove myself in this way. As l told you before that l will just chat with my clients thru the QQ during the business hours so as to keep well in touch with them for business needed, l never do it in my sparetime, instead l prefer to call my friends out for fun and chat face to face, that's me! See?
Hi Andy,
When I'd been burned once, I started writing to four ladies. After about 4 EMFs, I told each of them that I would like to move to direct contact after the exchange of about 10 EMFs, and that, if that was a problem with any of them, then, regrettably, I would have to say goodbye. One disappeared immediately, which left me with three who agreed. Then I picked one, and it worked.
Only you know whether you can risk not having the webcam. If you can't, I would advise saying that. It's not just about trust, either. It's about building a relationship through looks and gestures and voices. My hunch is that she doesn't want you to see her. She's pretty tooled up with technology, and she may be the only woman in all of China who doesn't use QQ to chat to her friends. Ha ha! I think she has revealed her feelings by talking about seeing strange things through the webcam. - I think she's more worried that YOU'LL see strange things.
Ask her if she's heard of something called an internet cafe, and say that the minute either of you see anything STRANGE, you can run away, screaming.
More seriously, you have to make a decision about what you can live with. For me, I wouldn't be able to take even one more letter, let alone months of risking more disappointment. It's not nice to make ultimatums, but in this instance, things should become clearer.
Good luck,
Alex
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Well.
Maybe "talking" about the past is not the righteous thing to do, because everybody is different.
So, as I can read your message, the lady has "some nice character", because she says what's wrong, what she doesn't like to do, and for sure, man can understand it.
For sure, no webcam, no QQ, no phone sessions don't help... but maybe can you give her some time, and see how it would evolve before asking about it again.
However, that lady seems to be "honest" in her letter.
I'd give it a try before going there if I was you. But it's also your choice :)
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I may be reading this wrong I am not sure.But just a thought that some people when they hear about web cam take it wrong.They think on the gutter side and think a person wants web cam to do in appropriate things.She may have heard these stories I dont know like I said its just a guess.I explained to my lady it would be nice to see her smile and her eyes.And she could see mine.It would almost be like being there.Like I said its a guess.I did get a picture that didnt apear to be photo shopped.
Ron
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My 2 cts:
Lady n°1: I included my QQ number in a letter after 5 or 6 EMFs and was promptly added, I didn't lose a word over it other than: if someday you would like to chat ... we chatted a lot but usually no cam. Unfortunately things did not work out and we broke up.
Lady n°2: Included QQ details after 1 month of writing, should be added tomorrow, we'll see. Again, I just said if you ever wanted to ...
It doesn't pay to put them under pressure, remember the thing about preserving face. Also telling them your dating history could be badly taken. I'm talking to 25-35 year olds, photoshop hasn't been an issue for me yet, the natural pics are in line with the rest.
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Ok, make some room here in this little circle. I'm not fully convinced she wrote that entirely. It sounded more like a combo of both her and the translator who might have put the bug in her ear not to do the cam or QQ so soon. (No EMF money in it). Let things die down for a while and bring it back in at a later date. Suggest a webcam at the agency? Move to QQ after that. She might have been on the fence about it and the agency pushed her to the other side. Give it more time (if you want).
Like Voice and some others said, don't go into the last few women you talked to. I never do that. Even the locals will ask and I don't tell them anything except, "I'm divorced, enough about that".
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Thanks so far guy's.
A little more info for you. We have been very candid with each other from the start, She asked me about how many previous girlfriends i have had in the past and why we broke up, she has also told me about hers. We have not held back on anything so far. I sent her pics of me when i was in China, and she asked me the reason for my visit, so i told her, as i believe in complete honesty as we all know if you hide something from the start it can well come back and bite you in the arse right? And she has thanked me for my complete honesty.
With the QQ and webcam, i said i have heard about the agencies offering this service to the girls, and suggested if she had no webcam then maybe this was an option. i also said i do not need a webcam chat asap, but just at least once before i commit to buying my ticket, which i have said due to my finances and having no holiday left from work this year, the earliest would be in April next year. Also, she says she uses QQ on a regular basis with clients everyday at her work, but she has yet to add my contact id. Even if she wants to wait to use it, i would have thought she would have added it to hers by now, do you agree?
I suggested the webcam for the future as it would also make us feel closer to one another, and the first and main reason i gave was so i could see here smile and beautiful eyes, so i don't think it would have come across i wanted to do it for inappropriate things. I have also included small messages at the end of my letters a few times to our translator, and she too seems genuine and says she wants to do her best for me and this lady.
Andy...
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Andy,
To give you a real opinion I think I would need to read all the letters. You tell, that you write with her everyday. What are your feelings? I know its tough to get burned. But as you got burned, you have become an "unbeliever". You do not trust her. But how should she trust you if you do not trust her? Of course, there are some that want to cheat. But there are also some who don't.
You write, she told you about her taste of music and her hobbies before you did. And with her real life pictures, you have gotten more then many other brothers here during the same time of writing. I think it is a token of her to show that she is serious. Do it like Voice suggest. Send her your mail-address and your QQ-ID. She will add you when she is ready. I did it the same way with my wife. I send her my email-address and told her "write me when you are ready". Shortly after that I received her first private email. Nobody likes to be pushed. How would you feel if she would push you the same way?
No one of us can tell what is right or wrong with this lady, we can give our opinion. But the decision is yours. If it was my relationship, I think I would appologize and give it some time.
All the best wishes!
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Again, thanks for your advise and support guy's it is all very useful.
I'm glad the brotherhood is here to help, i wish i had discovered this site before my first visit to China. In answer to Hajo, yes i have become an 'unbeliever', but its not that i do not trust her, i know it's only been a month, but if you guy's had have seen our other emails to each other you would see i care for this girl very much, but like is say, its not about trusting her, but more to the fact i do not trust Chnlove one little bit, i do not think they have either ours or the girls interests at heart. This is one reason why i want to get away from the emf's so i know for sure that this girl who i'm talking to is really her and not some 'ghost' sending me the replies to generate more emf revenue. I don't think it is a language barrier that is stopping her wanting the direct contact, as her profile does say she has good English skills, but then again, so did the girl who i went to meet, and that turned out to be untrue.
Andy...
Ps. Maybe i should say that it's not that i don't want to trust her, i do. But i find it hard to trust anything now when it comes thru a third party, i.e, from the agencies or Chnlove....
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At some point in time, these EMF based relationships we undertake, with a lot of interference and "spin" from our "friends" at CHNLove !! must begin to grow and evolve. It is a normal and natural progression that two people who are genuine in their wish to know more about each other should want to see the real peson through QQ.
IMO...there cant be any reasonable excuse for avoiding this next step if you have shared many EMF's and both of you think you have a chance to take the relationship further.
To play on the "dont you trust me" issue may well be more "spin" from the translator.....they want to make you feel guilty for doubting...but keeps the EMF revenue stream going !
My advice...QQ or bolt !!
DavidE
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My own personal view on this is that anyone who has both work and friends on QQ I would give a miss to. I had one relationship here here where QQ were coming in and being answered even whilst we were in bed!!
If the girl is heavy into QQ it will drive you mad as she will be QQing every where you are and you get to wonder just how many she is in contact with are other men.
What I would be concerned with is the point she made about having pressure put onto her. Whenever I have heard that from someone here it means you aint going anywhere with the relationship and I suspect this is often just agency translator talk to put pressure on you to keep using EMF. But that their commision on that is small fry to what the agency expects to collect from a successful marriage. Last one I heard the lady has to pay agency 38500 rmb for a marraige plus 10,000 for initial meeting with you.
My advice to anyone receiving early emfs like you did Andy is to move on. There are lots of women out there and if they are unwilling to speak on telephone then their English is so poor that you will have difficulty in communicating face to face without an interpreter unless of course your Chinese is very good.
Willy
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Andy,
If you write every day, and you've been writing now for a month, that's 30 EMF's each way. I think it's now more than reasonable to be asking to move the relationship on to the next level don't you??
You've been honest enough to tell this lady about your past experiences, and about your fears. I don't think it's reasonable on her part to turn your honesty against you, by claiming you now don't trust her (the guilt trip scenario). If she thinks anything about you mate i would expect her to be only too willing to actually see you face to face on a webcam conversation, or short telephone conversations.
So you are faced with the same conundrum as many others here, is this your lady talking or the translator/agency talking??
Personally, i think that if she's not prepared under any circumstances to move your relationship on to that next level using other means of communication like the phone or QQ, not even at the agency, then i would be cutting my losses and moving on!! We have seen what happens when the relationship revolves solely around EMF's alone.
As far as i can see, ....it don't look good for you Andy.....
David.....
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Andy I can see both sides of this.I can see the members saying yes If she won't QQ or web cam it is time to talk to someone else.I can also see what the other members think.That you haven't ben talking to this women long enough for it to progress to the next step.
I"m thinking what is your hurry?You have till April of next year.Give it another month and see where it goes.Give her and you sometime to know each other a little better.What have you really lost.By sticking with this women for another month.Maybe 150.00 dollers in Emf letters.
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Andy,
Heres my 02c worth
[1] On a practical level it seems to me that Chinese woman have a rather different mind set to Western woman.
Loss of face and/or peer evaluations seem high on the list.
Once I figured that, I said things like " I do not have a web cam. Would you like me to get one, so you can get to know more of me". She tentativly said "yes", and after a bit volunteered that she too had a cam and would I like to view :-)
Next I got a 5M USB extn cord, so I was able to show her my house and surrounds, which made her a lot more relaxed. Now we communicate regularly on Yahoo, with cam and voice. No secrets; a good sign!
[2] I share your reservations about ChnLove or its agencies.
I suspect that they have created "dummy" black hole accounts when I have asked for EMAIL addresses in the past
[3] Of course the underlying issue is Trust.
IMHO as long as we are looking for warmth, caring and relief from loneliness outside of ourselves, we will be trying to make the "other" into the "answer", as they may be doing to us.
As you have obviously observed, this process has a high failure rate :-).
I got to the stage (when I turned 40) that I realised the problem was within, not without, and then did what I needed to do by way of remedial work. Not entirely successfully, and its still an ongoing exercise. But its been helpful to learn to trust that things are unfolding just as they should :-)
And these are things that are known to chinese tradition:
" There is no need to run outside
For better seeing
Nor to peer from a window
Rather abide at the centre of your being:
For the more you leave it, the less you learn "
Lao Tze ~400 BCE ( a long time ago!)
:icon_biggrin:
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Pah, don't take any rubbish about not having QQ. Everyone seems to have it, my lady can use it on her mobile phone.
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Andy,
I stick with Max on this one. Give it a little more time. If you move on, you might keep moving on to the next and the next and the next. Which is going cost a lot of money too. I remember, I had the same doubts with my wife. There had been days where almost crawled up the wall because I did not know what to do. I remember the feeling. You write to somebody you have a good feeling with, on the other side there is all the unsure/unsecure. Is she real or not.
It is expensive to write everyday, I remember that, he he. My and my wife wrote each other everyday through EMF, two times even twice a day. But her letters were rather long and sincere. Mostly one page in print.
Of course, nobody can garantee anything. But if you feel good with her, stick with her a little longer. The best prizes demand the hardest work, so to speak. I hope she is the right one for you and hopefully it will be confirmed in one or another way.
All the best!
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Pah, don't take any rubbish about not having QQ. Everyone seems to have it, my lady can use it on her mobile phone.
And isn't QQ the worst thing that has ever happened on a mobile phone.
Willy
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Thanks guy's for your different thoughts on this, i see it is kinda a 50/50 split, some say run for the hills, n others say stick it out a bit longer. I guess if i had not been kinda burned twice already then i would not be asking this question right? Its a shame that the few bad apples out there, make us doubt the genuine people that are here. Well if i do not write her a reply soon, she may think i am not sincere and want anything to do with me anyway. One thought did cross my mind was that after my letter saying about what had happened in the past and about all the 'ghost' writers out there, the photoshopping and scammers that we the guy's on Chnlove know full well about, thinking that i may be on to her (if she is not a genuine person here) would i have got the reply she sent? Or thought '' i'd better move on to the next sucker, as this one is starting to figure me out? '' Just a thought. :dodgy:
Again Thanks.
Andy...
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Wills I have not said anything about this because...Well to be honest I am not too sure what to say. Especially after my latest episode...!!!
I must admit and I know this to be TRUE because of the lady before I wrote to before Ke Ren THERE ARE TRUE AND HONEST LADIES on Chnlove.
What the guys who are telling you to run TAKE IN...What the rest are saying TAKE IN...
There is only one person that can make the difficult decision on this and that is down to YOU.
I like some of the rest and you, believe if she was scamming you SHE would have RUN to the hills. Maybe me being a romantic sort of lovable kinda guy (LOL) cannot see the trees for the forest !!!
Sorry if this has not been of any help, its just my mundane thoughts...
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Cheers Rob, i know what you are saying, n read thru your situation too. (was sorry to read that) I just wondered out of all the brothers out here, has actually anyone fell in love,met, then married the first girl they got to know? I remember reading a post once, with guy's suggesting we start up our own agency with the guy's in China sorting things out at their end, n having girls who we know are genuine, but it did not work out, but your still friends with, or the female mates of their wives n girlfriends who are looking for western men to start a life with. At least then we would be looking out for each other and not relying on the agencies and Chnlove. Did that ever happen? I think the Shark said he had enough contacts to get something going, with translators etc, but then he never came back after being banned right?
Andy..
Ps, i have just finished my reply basically saying sorry for making her feel uncomfortable and pressureized, but i do feel that more direct conact is the natural proggerssion between people who want to build a lasting loving relationship but maybe she thought this was too soon? And i am happy for her to get to know me more first, then when she felt ready for the more direct contact to let me know.
I know she was very badly hurt by her last boyfriend (i wont go into details) So where i am a little cautious due to my experiences here. She probably is the same about rushing into things due to her last boyfriend. Well the message is sent so time can only tell what happens next. :icon_biggrin:
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Pah, everyone has QQ here. Even my girl's mother can use it. My lady has it on her phone. Anyone who tells you they can't use it is not worth bothering with imho :icon_cool:.
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Andy I wrote one women.We have ben married for over 3 years now.We have one son.And another one that is due to be born in late January.Ed Watson wrote one lady.Made the trip.And married her.Martin wrote letters and moved to web cam.Then went to China and married his wife.
Ed wrote letters for I think about 6 months.Martin was the same thing.Letters and webcam for 6 months.I wrote letters for 2 months.Then went to China.So as you can see it does happen but not very often.And there is no secrete formula for success.
In some respects this is just like trying to date women in your own country.You just have to keep trying till you get the one that fits.
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It is very hard to say what it right. I think just be very cautious as you are doing. My experience was unusual in some ways where almost everything was written by the translator, but after she and i met we fell in love and are now happily married. As happy as you can be separated by 7000 miles anyway. I talk and see her twice a day on QQ. My stepdaughter has QQ on her phone. I am putting it on my blackberry also. So the excuse of not having it is very little. But, i can understand her not doing it at work. Most all of these ladies i have met take their work very seriously. After all it is very hard to find a good career job. But, internet cafes are all over the place and most all have webcams, so that excuse is weak also. My translator used the same excuses. That was at the beginning of the brotherhood and i didnt heed the warnings. Of course I am glad I didnt but I really think I am in the minority on that.
We are there for the purpose of finding our love and we want to find it, therefore we tend to believe what is written to us and that is what makes us such good targets for the unscrupulous agencies. There are good agencies and bad ones but I dont think I have read anywhere here where the translator did not get involved in prettying things up. Some of it is to help get the right feeling across and push things forward and of course others are out and out lies. Distinguishing which is which is the trick and we can only go on our instincts and the tips from here in what to look for. Usually if you ignore the signs you get burned. But, every woman is a bit different. We all take leaps of faith. You did and got burned the first time. I feel if you have had good instincts in the past, listen to them. If not, then listen to the brotherhood. Most all of us here have been through it, done it, seen it, heard it, got the t shirt and the DVD. If I were you and we are split like this, I would sit down and write out the pros and cons. Write a few more EMF's and if she does not want to move forward then make your decision based on all of that. As Rob said you are the only one that can make the decision as you have read all of her mail and it is your money.
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Cheers to you all.
To be honest i'm still so split down the middle about this one, but i do see that most of the guy's seem to be saying cut your losses. Whats annoying now is that i sent my letter yesterday, long before the close of business in China, and the letter is still undelivered.....!! so she now wont get it till monday, and a good chance her reply may not get to me until tuesday, this is another reason why i hate the emf's, things sometimes take ages to get translated and delivered to your chosen lady. But i have to say, that after writing my letter yesterday, i think i'm leaning towards the cut my losses option. I have found one of the affiliated agencies now has video profiles. Tho not many of the girls have used it, but there are quite a few on there who have. At least then you get a better idea of her true looks and English ability. Tho, there is still no guarantee that she is the same girl answering your emf's right? But if this girl is the real deal, i think i will give it at least another month just to see if she will give me more direct contact. I mean, if she is my true love, spending another £100/£150 on emf's is kinda worth it i think. But it is her birthday on the 27th, i have already sent her a card via snail mail, and maybe rather stupidly, a small gift through Chnlove (i'm a sucker for it eh?:icon_biggrin: ) But if that does not show her i am genuinely interested in her, and i still don't get the progression in contact that i thought we should be doing. Then i'll be back on the market once again.... fourth time lucky maybe?? :icon_biggrin: Tho i think next time, i may ask my brothers first if they know of any suitable Asian ladies that are looking for an English boyfriend...
Andy....
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Andy
I wish I had more answers.
But I really reckon that you should aim to find someone who is wishes to go to the west. Someone who is planning to do this is learning English. Someone who has no English at all, has not really decided that this is for them. So I reckon find someone who speaks a little English, and that you leave emf's behind sooner rather than later.
There are good and bad translators, good and bad agencies. You don't know what you have until the very end. Fifty-fity are not very good odds. I reckon there are ways that are easier on yourself and your wallet, so I think avoid emf's, in the way you seem to be thinking.
Please note that I am sure people manage to work it out even when there is no common language, but I think, it's really difficult.
Danny
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Cheers Danny.
I know what you are saying, but in my first emf to this lady,(and to any lady i have sent 'feeler' emf's out to) i did say that i want my chosen lady to begin our life together in England, and i have no intention to move to China at this stage in my life, so if she was not prepared to do this, then there would be no point in starting a dialogue with her. She claims to be happy to move here. Also her profile says she has fair English skills, which in an earlier emf, she claimed were at conversational level, so according to her, plus combined with my pigeon Mandarin, we should get along fine without the translators. This is why i thought that we were at a point for more direct contact. But then who knows, maybe i have a bad agency here, and i do not know that if this lady IS genuine, she maybe getting my emf's 'doctored' and may have no idea i want more direct contact due to the agency leaving this out of the emf's so they can generate more emf revenue?:dodgy: Out of interest, has anyone else delt with Jiangmen Jiangmei International Marriage Co. LTD. P662? Do we know of their reputation?
Andy.
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Guys, guys, guys, guys, guys, guys, guys, guys, guys,
QQ is one of the biggest brands in China. I've seen QQ on advertising hoardings, you can buy the penguin plushie, you can use it on your mobile phone. If your lady claims to not know what it is or won't use it, then be suspicious or move on and find another :icon_cheesygrin:.
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QQ is one of the biggest brands in China. I've seen QQ on advertising hoardings, you can buy the penguin plushie, you can use it on your mobile phone. If your lady claims to not know what it is or won't use it, then be suspicious or move on and find another
It's not totally good advice. My ladies mobile does not have it. It's the service she has. No texting. It's a basic service. They are phasing this out and currently she is shopping for a new phone. So to say to be suspicious or move on? It doesn't mean the lady is lying to you. She has to upgrade her service.
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Yes, i have to agree with Vince on that one, as i beleive you can only go onto QQ with your mobile if you can access the internet or it is wap enabled. As i also know of people in China who can not use QQ on their mobiles, and not all mobiles will allow texting out of the country they are in. It is not just china, as i have friends in South Africa who had this problem with their mobiles too, and had to Change their phones and contracts so they could send texts to the Uk.
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I myself can get on the internet from my mobile (at additional cost). I'm not sure I can put QQ on it? But I see it this way.. I have a computer for that. I have a cell phone for phone calls. Why pay extra money for something I don't use? She's the same way. :icon_cool: I offered to send her a computer. She said not to spend the money for one, instead use the money to come in person. The computer wouldn't be used so she sees it as a waste. And I'm not spending money for something that's going to sit on a desk collecting dust. We do fine calling on the phone.
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Hello Jim.
Well i'm 36, kinda going on 26 (i still like going to gigs n festivals etc) but i still want a lady to share my life, n settle down with. I have noticed that a lot of Chinese women seem to more marriage orientated at a younger age compared to western women, but i don't think an age gap of more than 10 years would be a good idea, i guess it depends on the lady. Oh i'm 6'4 too, so bare that in mind...:icon_cheesygrin: But i'm still hoping for the best with the lady in question at the moment. Its her birthday in a week and i have sent her some things, hoping this may convince her i'm genuine n maybe get the contact i want. i have mentioned i could call her, but i have not asked for her number directly yet. ( but she has not offered it either) i'm pretty active and like the slender athletic looking ladies. so if you think they maybe suitable, let me know. But like i say, i'm gonna give it another month n see what happens. But cheers for the info..:icon_biggrin:
Andy...
ps. if i do become back on the market, i'm looking for a lady to live here in the UK with me, so she will have to want this too.
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I've just been chatting to one on Yahoo, she doesn't use QQ !! So that exists after all :icon_cheesygrin:
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Thats a shame Jim.
But I agree with the age thing, yes maybe 5 years is better, the girl i'm chatting to will be 31 on the 27th. but i think age kinda relates to your lifestyle too, i'm not saying i'm immature, but i do not think i live the life of your average 36 year old...! most people i meet think i'm still in my late 20's (makes me feel good..!:icon_cheesygrin:) But i also notice that in a lot of different cultures it seems the norm for the girl to be with a guy 10 years older, i have a few Indian mates and the girls seem to like the older man, mostly because they are more stable and tend to want to play the field less, one of my mates, she is 27, but happily goes out with guys in their late 30's. With her mom and dad, their is a 18 year age gap and they are happily married. One of my bf girlfriends is English born Chinese n her little sister was 21 and seeing a guy who was 39...! Different cultures see age differently i think. But no your right and unless she is wiser in her mind than her actual age, my preference is 29/30+.
Andy...
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Hi Guys.
Ok i thought i had put a nail in this one and it was finished for the time being as i was intending to give it a while longer and see what will develop. I sent her an emf on saturday and i got her reply today, i know she did not get it until monday so the four day wait was not an issue, but her reply, well has kinda raised that red flag again so i will share with you in what she wrote to me and i would appreciate any input, (That's if any guy's are still following this...:icon_cheesygrin:) I will add my message to her first, i thought about editing the soppy stuff out, but then it would not give the whole picture. :icon_biggrin:
''Ni hao my dear Lianne.
Ni hao ma? Thank you for your reply, and i am sorry for my late reply, but i was thinking very hard about what you had said. I am sorry that i put pressure onto you and made you feel uncomfortable, as truly this was not my intention. But yes, trust is the most important thing in a relationship, especially when we are so far from each other right? Although, i was i little confused, as the main reason for wanting the webcam chat was so i can see you beautiful eyes and see your smile when i am talking to you not for you to prove yourself to me. But you say you do not want to use the webcam as you do not to see anything inappropriate? So do you think this is why i suggested the webcam for inappropriate reasons? I would have hoped that you would know me better than that, as i would never do something like that to you.
I understand what you say about using the QQ just for work purposes, and saying that you prefer to call you friends out and see them face to face, but you and i really do not have that option do we? I just thought that we can use all these other ways of communicating to strengthen our bond right? I just think that it is the natural progression between to people who want to develop a strong relationship with each other. But maybe you need more time first right? Maybe it was because of my previous bad experiences here made me push you for more contact too quickly yes? And with your last relationship that effected you so badly, maybe you are now more cautious in new relationship and want to take things slowly right? Its just we have written so much to each other, and we both have been so honest from the start, i feel i know you very well already even in just the month we have been in contact with each other. I know it is early days, but i have such a good feeling about you, i find myself thinking about you everyday at work. i will often drift off into my mind at work and think about how you are and what you are doing. So i will hope to get to know you better first before i ask you anything like this again, and when you are ready, i hope that you will let me ring you sometime on your phone, or send you a little message to your QQ or email saying how much i am thinking of you ok? :))
One thing you did not say in your last message was your thoughts on adoption? As this is a subject that is close to my heart and is very important to me, as being adopted myself.
So you had to go for a business trip? What was that like? did you have to travel to another part of your country? How long was you away for? And how is your weekend going? Did you manage to get all of your work done, so you do not have to work overtime? As for me, your boy is still in his bed while writing you this message. (laptops are great yes? :)) ) I have to go into town soon as i have to do something for someone i know, then onto the gym again. Your boy wants to be in good shape for his girl, in case she makes him climb the high mountains in China. :)) And then tonight i am off to a friends for dinner. My parents have gone away for a few days so they are not around this weekend. They have gone to a old country house for a few days down by the coast, something i hope we can do together on day soon.
I shall go now, as i really do have things to do today, but sorry to make you feel uncomfortable and pressurized.
Bao zhong my sweet girl.
Yours,
Andy.
xx ''
Her reply...
''Ni hao Andy,
Wo hen hao, dan shi hen lei, xie xie! l hope you all fine and everything goes well too.
Sorry for haven't give you an answer last about the thoughts on adoption, as a matter of fact, l haven't had many thoughts about this, and l did feel puzzled about what you mean when asking this question, do you think l will care about your attorneyship? To tell you the truth, l've been taken part in the salvations of the orphans before, l do poor them that lost their own parents when they was still little and need love and help most, so you should be a lucky one that was adopted by a very good couple, and grown up in such a great warm family atmosphere, do you think so? Tha's why you should cherish and nourish them as much as you can in your sparetime, see?
As a good normal human being, l think we should always be kind, nice, positive and optimistic to life, trust is the essential and most important in keeping any relationship well, we couldn't keep our mind staying in the old age, staying in the terrible life experience before, we have to look forward instead of look back!!!! Anyhow, l do hope you can understand my mind, my thinking!
Now l was out in Harbin in the Northeasy China which was far far away from Guangzhou, really cold and the hard work did make me feel crazy exhausted, l just hope to have more rest and sleep, but l still need some more time to adjust my biological clock here, have a nice day anyway.
Bao zhong,
Lianne ''
I find this reply, well apart from it being the shortest letter she has written to me, i find it a little vague, almost like she has not read my letter to her. There is no mention of the direct contact, even if it is in the future. I would have thought that she would have at least said, ''yes lets give it a little more time first and then lets see'' I feel like this is a letter written by someone else and not her. What do the brothers think? Am i just being paranoid now? I just think that if she had said to me about a bad experience she had in coming to England in meeting her man and she would like a little more contact just to be sure it will not happen again, then i would be ''Here is my email/phone number/ QQ id, when we have some time maybe we can chat direct so you know i am genuine'' But her last letter just seems to dismiss the whole subject. Do you agree? Or like i say, do the majority think i am just being paranoid now? Oh, n i don't know if you think it makes a difference, but FYI, she has been on Chnlove since May 2008.
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Andy I like Jim's answer.Ride it out for a couple of more letters see if it gets any better.If it don't find somebody else to talk to.
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Cheers guy's
Any advise is good advise, all points are valid right? I think i will write another letter Addressing the same points, i'm not asking for immediate direct contact, i just need to know this is the direction we are heading in. I don't think i'm asking too much am i? If she says nothing but emf's and expects me to accept that, then i think something is afoot right? She says to trust her, which i want to, but actions speak louder than words would you not agree? If you like someone, then i would expect you would want to phone them/send personal direct emails, It's not a language barrier as her profile says she has good English, and she did say in a previous email, she often chats to her mates in English. I am beginning to suspect there is a lot more translator imput here....
Lets see what happens tomorrow, i maybe back on the market yet again....:(
Andy.
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Andy,
I am going to run a little contrary to what the others might have been saying. Could it be possible you are pushing too hard? You said you would leave the soppy stuff in. Where is it? It sounds to me like you are drilling her for answers. Insanity is doing the same thing again and expecting different results. Life does not work that way. There wan't anything fun about that letter: there wasn't anything lovie dovie about it; there want anything light hearted. If a woman was grilling me over several letters I would be running too. Lighten up. talk about the price of tea in China for goodness sake; the weather; her pictures. Tell her how hot she is or how beautiful she looks.
The next letter don't ask any questions about issues, just love on her a little. Then see what happens. If she gives you the polite well nothing letter then you know the flame is out.
Shaun
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I know what your trying to say shaun, but if you have read the majority of her previous letters and things she has asked me in the past, then the letter i wrote her last is not that much different from ones she has previously sent me. This new letter, the way it is written, the way she begins and ends the letter, to me, i honestly think its not her. Like i say maybe i'm being paranoid from my last two bad experiences here. Maybe i've made my mind up wether it is really her or not. But until i get some form of direct contact or the future agreement of it at some point i think i will always doubt her.... Maybe it is time to move on as we could both be wanting or expecting different things from this type of relationship?
Cheers
Andy.
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Greetings Brothers,
Well Andy I have to go with Shaun on this one. First we dont know what you guys say in your other letters or how romantic or not you both are with each other, but as Shaun says if you both have had bad experiences then maybe its time to romance the lady before you ask for what she is reluctant to give.
Keep in mind I am probably the most romantic on these forums and my heart definitely rules my head but it has worked well for Zhen and I as she is more romantic than i am. So I am a big fan of doing the romantic instead of the practical, at least some of the time.
Lets not forget these ladies may have been burned by guys before and are a tad gunshy when being pushed for alternate means of contact than emf's. I would say give her some room on the other contact types and maybe romance her for a few letters. As the guys say if she still doesnt open up and become more interested in the relationship then its pretty clear. Perhaps she wants a little romance before she gives in to the other contact types.
As has been said elsewhere every lady is different and reacts differently to what they see as pressure. Take some time put in the romance perhaps offer her more about you and your life, tell her she is beautiful and anything else you like about her. Build up how you feel fo rher and what about her gets you. Maybe she just wants to hear how much you care about her.
This of course is only my opinion and I sure dont expect everyone to have the resut that Zhen and I have but it cannot hurt to invest the time, unless you already figure its over then of course end it gently and move on.
Good luck brother,
Zhen and Brian
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wills I've not said anything about this yet I don't think...Anyway I would go for at most 2 more letters.
On saying that, my first letter to the ladies now after any response to cupids sent to them from me is...
This may be the wrong thing to put into our first letter but, there are a few things I would like to know, and I hope you don't mind answering them?
(1) Would you be willing to be in an exclusive relationship with me?
(2) Would you be willing to send ordinary picture from you at home with family etc?
(3) Would you be willing to speak to me on the phone?
(4) Would you be willing to go on webcam to speak to me?
(5) Would you be willing to give me your personal yahoo address?
The reason I mention these things right away, is so I know that my lady is willing to use these methods and will help cement the relationship. By using the webcam it means that we will both be able to judge better if the one is for the other. and will see each others smiles. Please DON'T misunderstand me, I DON'T MEAN doing this right away, I mean a FEW weeks down the line once we have exchanged a few emf's and gotton to know each other better..
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Cheers Guy's and to Rob, You did give me some advise on this in an earlier post...:) And i appreciate any input. What you say is a good idea, if i had mentioned this in my first few letters i may not be having this issue now. I know some brothers think maybe i pushed too hard too soon, but i just thought that we had good enough progression in our relationship by now to at least start talking about more direct contact. What worries me, is what appears be her outright refusal to even consider this. It makes me think she is hiding something. Well i have decided to give it a little longer, and i wrote to her yesterday. I made no mention of direct contact and just asked how thing were and how much i think about her, kept it nice and sweet. Her reply today again seemed vague and distant. I'm thinking one of to things. Maybe now she has gone off me and is just being polite in replying to me. It kinda reminds me of earlier on in this relationship as i sent out two 'feeler' emf's at the same time, one to her and one to another girl i was interested in, my girl wrote back first with an emf that really impressed me and i felt there could be a good connection, but a few days later the other girl sent a reply. To be honest i was not that interested in her by then, as Lianne (the lady in question) had already interested me so much, but i sent a few reply emf's anyway, as you never know right? But i think you could tell by my letters that i was not too interested in this second girl, so i eventually said i thought it was not to be, wished her the best with her search and goodbye. I now feel that this is the kind of letters she is sending me now. Maybe she is also writing to another guy who she prefers? My second thought is that she is no longer writing to me, but her agency is trying to sucker a few more emf's out of me?
Like i say, i will give this a bit longer, mostly as it is her birthday on tuesday, I don't think it a nice thing to end this just before, in case i'm wrong and she is genuine. Saying you i not think it is working out between us just before her day is a little wrong i think. I have sent a card via snail mail, it is to her work address which is a big university, so i'm thinking they are used to getting non-Chinese script letters sent there so i'm hoping it will arrive. Also i bought her a silver bracelet, through Chnlove, who say they send it to the ladies address and not to her agency, so if my second thought is right, i would think the agency would not know about this, as i have not mentioned i am doing either in any letter, it will be interesting if i get a thank you for the gift. If i don't, i guess i am no longer talking to this lady and it is the agency sending me replies to my letters. Maybe if she is genuine, my gift will help her in seeing that i am sincere in wanting to be with her, and it may help in developing our relationship.
Roll on tuesday.... :)
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Ok, so it looks like i am back on the market again. I have given this much thought, but i have decided to end things with the girl i was writing to. I have just sent her this reply, i hope my words were not harsh and i hope she will understand. What do you guy's think?
''Ni hao Lianne.
I hope you are well. I will first of all apologise to you, as i do not think you will enjoy this letter to you. It is not an easy decision that i have made here and i have been thinking about this long and hard since your reply regarding the direct contact, i thought i would give it a while longer to see if things developed. But in your last letter you talk about winning your heart, and i do really like you, but does not my heart also needed to be won?
It is not about trust that has made me decide this, but you want and need things for a relationship to work right? The thing is, so do i. One of the things that i do need for my feelings to develop towards you is direct contact, i want to see your face, to hear your voice so i can feel closer to you, and i would of hoped so that you would also feel closer to me. But you say you do not use QQ for chatting with friends, you will not use the webcam at all, i have said i could maybe ring you, but you have not offered your phone number to me. I am not pressurising you, and i respect your decision to say you will not do this. However i do not see how we can truly get to know each other without doing these things. So although it does sadden me greatly, i think that we expect different things from this kind of relationship, so maybe what you said a while back is correct, maybe we are not as well suited to each other as we originally thought and i feel it best that this was to finish this now rather than later.
I truly do hope that you will soon find your soulmate, and as i have said, it does sadden me, but regretfully i think that this will be for the best. You have made a friend here, but we are both looking for more than that right? You have my email, and you are welcome to stay in touch with me, but i understand if you do not wish to do this.
Again i am sorry if my words have upset you, but please take care of yourself, and i hope the right man for you will arrive in your life soon, but sadly, i do not think that this man is me.
Bao zhong Lianne.
Ni de Andy.''
To be honest, I think i am going to give up Chnlove now, i am still interested in Asian culture, but i do think that the website is too untrustworthy. I know a lot of guy's have found their true loves here, but i think more of us have not. I do not really like the way it operates, with the hidden charges for the ladies if she finds her man, the way emf's are translated, it was one reason why i always chose a lady who said she has good English skills, as i want to communicate to her and not through a third party all the time. I want to know her words are hers and nothing has been added by the translator. It was not an easy decision, since my last post on this thread we have sent each other about ten more emf's. (20 if you include her replies) But i am not going to blindly trust the emf's. I took a leap of faith last time and that crashed and burned. I still hope to find my Chinese soulmate, but i think i will try some other dating sites now, i have found a few that seems to have Asian ladies already living in my country, i know there are probably scammers there too, but at least it will not cost £££££'s and a 14 hour flight to find you've found one right?
Andy....
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Well Andy, If she wasn't for you and it wasn't going the way you thought then you did the right thing. It's not harsh at all that I see.
No need to walk away from the forum either. We are for China relationships not just Chnlove. It doesn't matter what site your meeting them on. Unless you find a local it will still cost £'s and a 14 hr flight.
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Cheers Vince.
I'll still be around here, but just might give the international dating sites a break for a while. :)
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To be honest, I think i am going to give up Chnlove now, i am still interested in Asian culture, but i do think that the website is too untrustworthy. I know a lot of guy's have found their true loves here, but i think more of us have not. I do not really like the way it operates, with the hidden charges for the ladies if she finds her man, the way emf's are translated, it was one reason why i always chose a lady who said she has good English skills, as i want to communicate to her and not through a third party all the time. I want to know her words are hers and nothing has been added by the translator. It was not an easy decision, since my last post on this thread we have sent each other about ten more emf's. (20 if you include her replies) But i am not going to blindly trust the emf's. I took a leap of faith last time and that crashed and burned. I still hope to find my Chinese soulmate, but i think i will try some other dating sites now, i have found a few that seems to have Asian ladies already living in my country, i know there are probably scammers there too, but at least it will not cost £££££'s and a 14 hour flight to find you've found one right?
Andy....
It saddens me to read your post here, Andy, because I believe I can fully understand your feelings. Especially about the untrustworthyness of Chnlove. Even though I feel that my lady is sincere, I am constantly worried about what the translator's role in our communication is. Not knowing what is her true words and what is not makes me crazy (and short emails in Chinese is not the same as long love letters in English). Sending love letters, having them translated, getting a reply and having that translated, not being able to talk on the webcam when I like to because she insists she wants interpreter on her side, living and working 400 km away from the agency where the translator is... Everything is just so complicated!
I have thought of the same thing: finding another dating site which offers direct communication with girls who actually know a lot of English. However, I am in too deep with my present contact to call things off at this point. But if it does not work out, I will leave Chnlove. It is simply too expensive and too complicated.
Please post your experiences with other dating sites, Andy, and let us know how it goes! Keep the spirit!
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Keep your spirits up Andy...
I know it was hard for you to do what you think is for the best..
But, as the rest say, use this forum, we are not just for Chnlove, we are for Chinese relationships, and take it from me, a better bunch of guys you will never meet.
Take Care my friend, and I hope to hear from you again...
Rob
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Andy
I am sorry to hear about your decision, but certainly respect your right to do what you think is best for yourself and your future.
I think I might claim some experience of failing to find the "right" woman...I went to China 5 times before I found this Forum and all the incredible and wise advice that the Bros have posted.
Since I found this Forum, I have been very precise in my correspondence with maybe 8 Women in all...I have said (politely), early on in the correspondence that I would only consider a longer term correspondence with a woman who was prepared to send original photos and who would be prepared to speak person-to-person on QQ or telephone.....I got this advice from somewhere on this Forum, but I cant remember exactly who said it, but it is right !!!
As you would expect, several women tried to sneak around this rule of mine....and I suspect it was the translators at work here !!
But several women responded without any problems about what I had asked and they sent the photos and we arranged QQ sessions ...no problem.
It is said, that of all the eligible women on CHNLove, perhaps 10% meet your criteria in some way. ....and, of all the Men on CHNLove, you maybe meet the criteria of 10% of the women. So far it looks like the potential for a good match is running at 1% !!!!!!
So my point is...its probably a numbers "game" and the trap we fall into is to extend the time of correspondence in hope that things will get better....but we keep throwing money at it when we should move on !!!
The sound advice I got here was to give it a good, honest try, but understand and accept when it is time to move on and look for another woman.
Maybe you have come to far with understanding to give it all up ?????...becvause there ARE some GREAT Ladies out there in CHNLove...we just gotta dig harder to find them :):). There are many wonderful stories here of those Bros who have made it.
You have discovered all the traps and red flags already.......you have done the hard yards...time to have a win ???
Good luck, whatever you decide
DavidE
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I'll still be around here, but just might give the international dating sites a break for a while. :)
Andy
I don't think it hurts to try something different.
You could even try to do a few things all at once.
When I was looking around, I found match.com a pretty good service. It permits you to find people in your own city/state/country, and at the same time you can write directly to people in other countries (eg China). So, to use an Australian expression, on Melbourne Cup Day, have a bet both ways!
You have to keep remembering that things work themselves out and time is on your side.
Best of luck. Don't be a stranger. Stay in touch!
Danny
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Thanks David , As alway's good Advice .
You know for us Married ones here , that seem to have had it sooo easy ... to the point that at least I feel somewhat guilty , for having had little or no problem with Chnlove at all . It is easy for me to say , looking out my Window on all of this . But then again , I wouldn't say ... I had it that easy . Andy , you might not know , I myself had to go through three other Ladies before I found Qing . I owe it al to the first one I've met through Chnlove ( MIN ) , as I myself was to quit this search after her having a Boyfriend already . But she did not let me do this . So , I promised her I'll keep looking and after two more Ladies ... there she was , my beautiful Wife . So , you having had two failure's .. might be just what you need to find the really True Love that you came to look for .
Don't blame it on Chnlove or the Girl's , it was just not meant to be . So move on and try again ... isn't this what we all do in our Life's anyway , pretty much for everything we want ?
Give it some time and start fresh and alway's with a positive attitute . Give the new Lady a clean chance to be the " ONE "
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Very good David E,
With your permission I would like to use one of your lines in my profile update.
Shaun
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Cheers for the responses and pm's guys.
I had already had decided as this was my third attempt with Chinlove that if things did not work out with this lady i was going to walk away from the Chinlove site. I feel like it is a bit like a game of poker, i feel that it is like when you play a hand and become chip committed into the pot, you know in you head you should fold, but you keep on putting more and more chips in and when the river comes your busted by another hand. I see the emf's as the chips you put in, and if you leave it too long, you keep buying the emf's to put into your hand because you feel that you are now too committed to walk away, by the time you realise it is too late, you see how much money you have spent on a relationship that has gone nowhere. In my heart i wanted to carry on, but my gut feeling was that this would not work out. I could not really entertain the idea of going all the way to China again to meet a lady who i have not had any direct contact with. I thought it way too much of a bad gamble, so i folded my hand.... I am not saying everyone should do this as i know for many of you this has worked out, we all need to follow our own path right? And this was the one i chose, for someone else it maybe different, so good luck to you all.... I got a reply from her today and it looks like she agreed with me and wished me all the best. I'm happy i have not upset her.
I have looked at a few other sites, Asianeuro and Chineselove links, they appear to have quite a few Asian ladies already in the UK looking for long term relationships/marriage, so i may sign up for a couple of months and see if anything develops there. Both are run differently where you pay for a 3 month membership (or more) but you can send as many messages as you like as there is no emf's and translators to pay. I think for me, at the moment this is a better idea. I will let my brothers know how things go....:)
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Maybe give cherryblossoms.com a shot. I made some good contacts there!
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I meet my wife on Chineselovelinks or CLL for short. I never sent an emf with chnlove since i was being cheap and was not sure how honest the service was since most photos were studiost. In the general chat room on CLL there are ladies chatting with their webcam up for people to see. I find CLL is great for communicating with the girls directly but you have to be careful as some are just playing games. CLL did purged alot of their members since they were posting studio pictures but it was men on the otherside. Remember to ask for non studio photos. If your relationship is going smoothly set up a room in the chat room area to meet and see each other by cam.
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Very good David E,
With your permission I would like to use one of your lines in my profile update.
Shaun
Which one Shaun? I might like to use it too! Hopefully DavidE does not have copyright.....
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John,
It is, "I have said (politely), early on in the correspondence that I would only consider a longer term correspondence with a woman who was prepared to send original photos and who would be prepared to speak person-to-person on QQ or telephone....."
I would like to see how it is phrased in his EMF's or profile. But I am over at www.blossoms.com and having a fairly good time right now. These ladies must talk to more than one man because it takes a while to respond. But I'll check it out for a month or so.
Shaun
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Cheers for the responses and pm's guys.
I had already had decided as this was my third attempt with Chinlove that if things did not work out with this lady i was going to walk away from the Chinlove site. I feel like it is a bit like a game of poker, i feel that it is like when you play a hand and become chip committed into the pot, you know in you head you should fold, but you keep on putting more and more chips in and when the river comes your busted by another hand. I see the emf's as the chips you put in, and if you leave it too long, you keep buying the emf's to put into your hand because you feel that you are now too committed to walk away, by the time you realise it is too late, you see how much money you have spent on a relationship that has gone nowhere. In my heart i wanted to carry on, but my gut feeling was that this would not work out. I could not really entertain the idea of going all the way to China again to meet a lady who i have not had any direct contact with. I thought it way too much of a bad gamble, so i folded my hand.... I am not saying everyone should do this as i know for many of you this has worked out, we all need to follow our own path right? And this was the one i chose, for someone else it maybe different, so good luck to you all.... I got a reply from her today and it looks like she agreed with me and wished me all the best. I'm happy i have not upset her.
I have looked at a few other sites, Asianeuro and Chineselove links, they appear to have quite a few Asian ladies already in the UK looking for long term relationships/marriage, so i may sign up for a couple of months and see if anything develops there. Both are run differently where you pay for a 3 month membership (or more) but you can send as many messages as you like as there is no emf's and translators to pay. I think for me, at the moment this is a better idea. I will let my brothers know how things go....:)
Hey Wilsbrough,
You come across as a thoroughly good and decent man who has nothing to reproach himself for and who has every right to consider himself to be aggrieved and misled. Without any self-aggrandizement I like to consider myself in the same manner, as I believe that decency and goodness are important qualities in this fractured life. I only wish that Chnlove and its agencies and (some) of its ladies who cross our horizons shared those same values. Unfortunately, we are of those who are the easy prey to the machinations of those who do not share those values and seek only the instant profit of the innocent EMF victims. However, that will not always be the case and I believe that in time there will be retribution and a price to be paid. Most importantly, I sincerely hope you do not depart from this Brotherhood Forum as I have found your decency and humour to be most endearing. In this respect I am reminded of your 'translation post': "who are you? Where is the girl in the photo?" I was feeling rather down and depressed at the time but having read that I went to bed laughing and woke up still laughing. Absolutely priceless!!! I hope therefore that you will stay with us Wilsbrough; your decency, goodness and sense of humour are a valued and much-needed part of the fabric of this Forum.
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John,
It is, "I have said (politely), early on in the correspondence that I would only consider a longer term correspondence with a woman who was prepared to send original photos and who would be prepared to speak person-to-person on QQ or telephone....."
I would like to see how it is phrased in his EMF's or profile. But I am over at www.blossoms.com and having a fairly good time right now. These ladies must talk to more than one man because it takes a while to respond. But I'll check it out for a month or so.
Shaun
Thanks Shaun,
I was, in part, only joking for camaraderies sake, but I'm pleased to hear you are having a fairly good time at blossoms.com. May try it myself soon as I am becoming increasingly convinced that I, like many others before and indeed currently, am being 'translator scammed' by one of chnlove's agencies. In fact I have just been reading the Davidaquincy thread (don't know if you are familiar with it?) and there are some distinct familiaralties with it and my suspicions. I am not completely convinced yet, but if my suspicions are confirmed I will cause havoc for Chnlove and the agency concerned.
Enjoy at Cherry Blossoms!
John
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Thanks Shaun,
I was, in part, only joking for camaraderies sake, but I'm pleased to hear you are having a fairly good time at blossoms.com. May try it myself soon as I am becoming increasingly convinced that I, like many others before and indeed currently, am being 'translator scammed' by one of chnlove's agencies. In fact I have just been reading the Davidaquincy thread (don't know if you are familiar with it?) and there are some distinct familiaralties with it and my suspicions. I am not completely convinced yet, but if my suspicions are confirmed I will cause havoc for Chnlove and the agency concerned.
Enjoy at Cherry Blossoms!
John
John,
All of you bro's are good people, looking for the same! It's unfortunate, that many of us get played...by the women, translators, and agency's. Chnlove, should clean this mess up! I found Davidaquincy's thread today, in the back, with my old thread...of my first visit to China. I read through it and had complete empathy, for this man! These women shouldn't join a marriage site, if they aren't truly looking for a long-term partner! These women, that lead men on, are very pathetic! We all have enough of these women, in our own countries! Just keep your heads up and keep looking! You will find that special lady and have your dreams come true!
Jim
Jim,
I totally agree with what you have written - and that's what makes me so angry! These scammers, translators, agencies, Chnlove et al are playing with, and trampling on, the feelings and hopes of decent, good and well-intentioned people. Like you, I emphasised with Davidaquincy's situation and the sheer hopelessness of it all and retched at Chnlove's callous indifference to his plight. There are far too many similar stories posted on this Forum and I believe it's time to confront Chnlove aggressively in it's own 'back-yard'. Legal action and redress is extremely difficult, as DavidE has already rightly pointed out (although not impossible), and I am currently researching this avenue under Commercial Law. Chnlove knows that, because of the differences and contradictions in International Law, the legal route is fraught with problems and is content to hide behind that. Personally, I believe the thing Chnlove fears most is bad publicity - aggressively sustained and revealing bad publicity - the type of bad publicity that exposes its, and its agencies', corrupt practices. In this last respect, online petitions and press releases are powerful tools for focusing Chnloves attention on putting its house in order. Chinese University student newspapers(students of all nationalities are well-known for their sense of moral outrage); foreign embassies (this Forum is after all an international one) etc, etc. I do not think Chnlove would act so flippantly and arrogantly if its name was being bandied and muddied internationally - to say nothing of the delight that would give to its competitors. It would also not be over-keen on having its treatment and manipulation of its 'lady clients' exposed (complicit scammers excluded), to say nothing of the exhorbitant fees it charges them! I also do not accept the premise that Chnlove is not resposible for the agencies wrongdoing, or that the agencies are a separate entity to Chnlove. Chnlove is the parent body without which the agencies would not exist in the form that they do. Moreover, as I understand it, the contract for delivery of services, and the regulation of that contract, resides with Chnlove.
I will stop for now. But you may be assured that I will return to this subject at a later date.
John
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John,
It is, "I have said (politely), early on in the correspondence that I would only consider a longer term correspondence with a woman who was prepared to send original photos and who would be prepared to speak person-to-person on QQ or telephone....."
I would like to see how it is phrased in his EMF's or profile. But I am over at www.blossoms.com and having a fairly good time right now. These ladies must talk to more than one man because it takes a while to respond. But I'll check it out for a month or so.
Shaun
Shaun
My modus operandus is to allow maximum of 5 EMF's and in my 6th I say....
"I hope you can see that I have shown my willingness to correspond with you openly and honestly and to share with you my hopes and dreams for the future. I have demonstrated that I am sincere and do not play games with emotions.
I hope you feel the same and I think from here it would be proper for you to send me some daily photos, so that I can imagine you in your normal life....and also that we arrange to meet each other on QQ or some similar method.
This will confirm to me that you are also genuine in your search for a Western husband and it is an important "next step" in our relationship.
I should tell you with honesty that if you are not willing to do these things then I must question how sincere you really are.
etc etc etc !!!
The above is copyrighted...but this can be overcome by payment of a large fee....:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
DavidE
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John,
It is, "I have said (politely), early on in the correspondence that I would only consider a longer term correspondence with a woman who was prepared to send original photos and who would be prepared to speak person-to-person on QQ or telephone....."
I would like to see how it is phrased in his EMF's or profile. But I am over at www.blossoms.com and having a fairly good time right now. These ladies must talk to more than one man because it takes a while to respond. But I'll check it out for a month or so.
Shaun
Shaun
My modus operandus is to allow maximum of 5 EMF's and in my 6th I say....
"I hope you can see that I have shown my willingness to correspond with you openly and honestly and to share with you my hopes and dreams for the future. I have demonstrated that I am sincere and do not play games with emotions.
I hope you feel the same and I think from here it would be proper for you to send me some daily photos, so that I can imagine you in your normal life....and also that we arrange to meet each other on QQ or some similar method.
This will confirm to me that you are also genuine in your search for a Western husband and it is an important "next step" in our relationship.
I should tell you with honesty that if you are not willing to do these things then I must question how sincere you really are.
etc etc etc !!!
The above is copyrighted...but this can be overcome by payment of a large fee....:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
DavidE
David,
You smooth talker you. Of course I'll send you a natural photo and my QQ number... wait... :blush:
Ah hem... Excellent words. Would a couple of Fosters do?
Shaun
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David
Large sum coming your way; do you want Aus dosh or will pounds sterling suffice? Actually, I am being a bit disingenuous as I have really come here for your advice, although I may plagiarise some of your words too!
Firstly, would you include in your criteria that a demonstration of commitment would be that after, say your 5/6 EMF's, both you and she should agree to hide your profiles? I know I went through a good deal of heart-searching on this issue in previous posts when Fei's profile was refreshed but eventually accepted the wisdom and advice of experienced members that it meant nothing, that it was translator 'generated', and that Fei was probably not even aware that her profile had been refreshed. You are also probably aware that I pacified my angst by mentioning Fei's profile refresh in a humorous way to her in an EMF. However, in her reply EMF Fei thanked me for "understanding that she did not hide her profile", which would seem to indicate that 1) either she was aware of her profile refresh or 2) my humorous reference to it brought it to her attention. What I find difficult to understand is that Fei knows I have hidden my profile as I am not interested in Admirer Mails from other women and I am only interested in her. Conversely, Fei tells me that she only "chats" (writes) to me. But if that is the case, what possible motive can Fei have for leaving her profile open, other than to attract other male admirers? Please don't misunderstand my reasoning here; I am fortunate not to be possessed by a jealous or distrustful nature and am broadly of the belief that individuals must, within reason, do as they wish. My purpose therefore is not to analyse or reopen that particular profile refresh issue, but simply to pose the question in the first sentence above.
Secondly, I sent my last EMF to Fei at 6.35am and received her reply to it at 8.55am - approximately two and a half hours later! Given that Fei had written in her previous EMF: "as usual the translator translate into Chinese of your letter and I will write the context in Chinese of the letters which I reply you and then she help me translate into English", is it possible for all that to be carried out, plus the strictures of contact between Fei and the translator, in that short a passage of time? Annexed to that, this is the usual time-span of our sent and received EMF's, apart from the odd one, which took 6 hours to turn around. I am sure you will gather from this that I am beginning to think I am corresponding with a translator and not with Fei. Again, not paranoi, I just have a 'forensic' mind and, unfortunately (sometimes) a romantic heart, which tends to blind one to the obvious.
I would be very grateful for your advice on both of the issues I have raised above.
Cheers, John
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John, The woman hiding her profile is usually frowned on from the agency until there is a meeting of. When they feel there is a match and you have been there and maybe engaged is when they will hide it. Until then they want it to stay open feeling the woman is still open. They may have there way of persuading the woman to keep it open? So if it stays open for now? don't throw blame at the girl.
If the timing is right you can get a reply quick. The translator calls the girl and she replies over the phone. There has been times my lady did this. Mostly now she reads and replies herself. I can tell by the spelling. Each woman is different so again you can not put blame. Don't worry, Be happy....
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Thanks for that Vince,
I know that everything you say is right and I listened to, and took on board, all the excellent advice that you and the other bros gave me (including the 24 hour rule) when I was in a quandry over Fei's profile refresh before. I'm not beating myself up over it this time or resurrecting it again, although I do admit to having small moments of reflection. I was more interested in how that issue sat with DavidE's criteria for establishing and and taking forward an EMF instigated relationship. But, yes, you are absolutely right (as usual!)and I have no doubt at all that Fei's agency has ways of persuading her to keep her profile open - and I know in my heart that it's wrong to throw blame at her.
I am more worried about the second issue of the extraordinary across-the-world EMF turnaround. This is compounded by what Fei wrote to me, from which I understood she was talking about written translation rather than via the telephone. Perhaps I misunderstood that, but her replies are always so quick and there has been a distinct change in the tone of her letters, albeit that I welcome the disappearance of the translator's fluff. However, there is now very little warmth, if that makes sense? I certainly don't expect "Wo ai shang ni le" or "Wo yao yong yuan he ni zai yi qi", that would really worry me at this stage. But one needs to have a small candle of hope twinkling in the twilight hours. Oh, I'm sure you are right - don't worry, be happy....................Thanks again Vince, you are a diamond - well, not bad for a Florida guy...hahaha.
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John , without visiting all your posts , 1 - yes do not worry about refreshes , 2 - In the Chinese way , how long have you been emf'ing with no visiting commitment , because as most ladies ,but not all have been burned more than once by non appearance of guys , you will find things will cool to a certain amount ie ; more fluff by translators until some sort of commitment is given . Most translators would not be doing there job if she was only talking to you without any commitment from both sides such as camming etc , also visit other sites and see if your lady is registered there as there may be an alternate way of contacting her .
I met my Ying when I was with someone else in China , and as she did not speak English when I came home it was up to me to find her which I did on Asia Friend Finder , we sent a few no charge emails and then went to Yahoo messenger , and whilst she had been also registered with a Chn agency she did not even know that she was and still is shown as available on the chnlove website , but she has never received any mail via this way , so there is a possible scam , with the particular agency refusing to remove her listing until she shoves her red book in their face , but in my happy city of ChongQing if you arrived there with no one in mind , I would say you would meet 10 very beautiful ladies the first time you stepped out of the hotel , I had my Ying on my arm but I still had a swivel neck and was told look , but do not think about anything else , hehe , regards Ying and Robert .
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Hi Guy's.
So, i have now got myself a three month membership at Chineselove links, There seem to be plenty of Asian ladies living in my country on there. I put up my profile and have received lots of messages.... But, in my profile i stated that i was only looking for love within my own country, and i have to say, the vast majority of messages that i have received are from girls/ladies in China...! Hmm....:dodgy: One particular girl who i was attracted too, said she lived in Bath, England so i sent her a message, i got a very swift reply which made me happy, but guess what? Yep, she's actually living in China...!! A good start to an honest relationship right? Tho one lady is in Belgium, if that goes well i may think about a visit, at least i can just go there for the weekend and see if there is a connection. There are a few others, Not Chinese, but quite a sweet Malaysian girl is writing to me who live in Essex, Don't say it, as i've heard all the Jokes already. (the UK guys here will know what i mean:icon_cheesygrin:) And i have just sent out a few 'feeler' Letters to a few other Chinese ladies, Who say they are in the UK, but as with the other girl, i guess i'll have to wait n see if that's true. I'll keep you posted. But in quite a few cases i have gotten direct email address in the first or second letter, They all seem to have pretty good English abilities and as no translators are needed, no emf's are needed to be bought. I know there will be scammers here too, lets face it, pretty much every dating site will have them right? I guess time will tell if i'm speaking to the lady i think i am or to a guy called Orilekke in Gambia...:icon_cheesygrin:
Andy...
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Hi John....
Sorry, payment only accepted in Bullion...the Pound and the Greenback are getting worth less and less each day !!!!!
...To refresh or not...that is the question......
For me, I never put any connotation, good, bad or indifferent on this issue.
Because I dont think that the Lady herself necessarily has any influence on this decision. Profiles are the Agency/CHNLove "inventory" and represent all they have "for sale" into their marketplace.
So I theorise that they will hang on to profiles as live bait until the lady herself either meets her Western man and pays them the agreed Contract sum, or she can personally persuade/bully them to remove it for whatever other reason she has.
It is so easy for them to not pass on your request to both hide your profiles and to reply to you in the way they did...you have no idea what , if anything was actually said to Fei........this is the dreaded trap of the translator issue we all suffer from constantly.
You have no idea that Fei really asked them to hide her profile and they said 'yes' and they didnt do it......just wrote the fluff to you as if it came from Fei.
Can you see that this is a total catch 22 situation...never can be resolved until.....you meet her in person, or get onto QQ or similar. At that point, they cant interfere with you and her.
But , as I understand from the Women I have corresponded with /met...to get on to QQ involves them in a fee payable to the Agency...so to take this step, they will need to have some sort of thought that you are serious and genuine...not just after a cheap thrill. I have heard that sme women agreed to a QQ session with a Man and were confronted with him on camera...naked and "excited"...so dont forget that there are a huge number of weirdos/psychos out there and these women must be a bit careful about the more personal contact methods.
I know it is costly and filled with risk, but for me, if there appears to be genuiner interest on both sides, I would go to visit her and check out the Chemistry.
I truly believe that Ronan (Irishman) has got it right. He is prepared to dive off to China to verify which Ling, or other Lady might "light his fire"...and he is not clouded by being obsessively in love with every woman he has contact with. I will copy him, because I also believe (as I have posted here before ) that you cant be in love with someone you have never met (this is MY opinion and I know some of you dont agree...so be it ).
Only by a face-to-face can you ever be CERTAIN of anything !!!!
So that MUST be the Key Objective..to get to visit her (risky and costly) and decide what to do next , or..get on to QQ (cheaper but less effective) and also get off the Agency/Translator influence.
Shaun.....
FOSTERS ??????????????? How dare you propose to poison me after giving you freedom to use my copyright words...and i thought you were a mate !!!!
Fosters Lager is an abomination invented by Colonial Aussies to export all over the World to hopefully have a huge collective laugh at all the freocious hangovers.
Here we use it to clean the windows with...we would NEVER drink the stuff !!!
David E
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David E right on as ussual.Bigbutt allot of good points.Robert good post good points.It all comes down to this until all the ladies fees are payed.Her profile will remain open and avalable.Because of the reasons stated By David ,Robert and Abigbutt.
Hell my wifes profile was still open 6 months after she came to the states.
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David E,
I'll have you know that Foster's is my favorite beer. :angel:
No, I figured as such. It is like some of our American beer. If the Americans won't drink it then export it and sell it as America's #1 beer. Americans can make some really bad beer. But I could not resist the chance to say it. If I remember you do not drink.
I really am not a drinker anymore. I bet I don't drink a six pack a year.
Shaun
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Shaun , a six pack out here equals 6 multiplied by 18 gallon kegs any less and you are only sipping .
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Robert,
Like I said I don't drink much but I'll stick to the 6 pack. :s
In America it is 6 12oz.
Shaun
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzOjt1e5W8c
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To be honest, I think i am going to give up Chnlove now, i am still interested in Asian culture, but i do think that the website is too untrustworthy. I know a lot of guy's have found their true loves here, but i think more of us have not. I do not really like the way it operates, with the hidden charges for the ladies if she finds her man, the way emf's are translated, it was one reason why i always chose a lady who said she has good English skills, as i want to communicate to her and not through a third party all the time. I want to know her words are hers and nothing has been added by the translator. It was not an easy decision, since my last post on this thread we have sent each other about ten more emf's. (20 if you include her replies) But i am not going to blindly trust the emf's. I took a leap of faith last time and that crashed and burned. I still hope to find my Chinese soulmate, but i think i will try some other dating sites now, i have found a few that seems to have Asian ladies already living in my country, i know there are probably scammers there too, but at least it will not cost £££££'s and a 14 hour flight to find you've found one right?
Andy....
It saddens me to read your post here, Andy, because I believe I can fully understand your feelings. Especially about the untrustworthyness of Chnlove. Even though I feel that my lady is sincere, I am constantly worried about what the translator's role in our communication is. Not knowing what is her true words and what is not makes me crazy (and short emails in Chinese is not the same as long love letters in English). Sending love letters, having them translated, getting a reply and having that translated, not being able to talk on the webcam when I like to because she insists she wants interpreter on her side, living and working 400 km away from the agency where the translator is... Everything is just so complicated!
I have thought of the same thing: finding another dating site which offers direct communication with girls who actually know a lot of English. However, I am in too deep with my present contact to call things off at this point. But if it does not work out, I will leave Chnlove. It is simply too expensive and too complicated.
Please post your experiences with other dating sites, Andy, and let us know how it goes! Keep the spirit!
Hello hans
through your description ,now I know how hard for you to find your girl, But you never give up. Actually I think you need more encourage and the most important thing: find the right way to your girl. You can choose a more safety way.
Here is the suggestion I give to some western man who can stay in China,and want to meet some ladies which want to get married. If you can visit China for a trip someday, spent some months here. You can meet a lot of good girl in a party or some activities in real life which hold by a local Marriage agencies. In china, www.jiayuan.com is one of the biggest and professional dating website for local Chinese, they hold a party or outdoor activities monthly or each small or big festival in different cities ,You can meet these members face by face, and normal it will have 200-1000 people attend the activities, it depends on how big the festival it is .And some party is very strict to members to ensure the high quality of members. You also can google their phone number and call them or visit them(or bring a translator with you) to consult a special service for you , They will recommend some ladies which they think will match you request most(like language ability), they have better reputation and other local small agency, And it is more safe,Because you have to upload the id number of you, and other certificates like drive license, passort...you even can watch their programme from Hu Bei TV.(Monay to Thursday 12?35 -13?05 ) And I though it is more cheaper than those small unprofessional agency.They have each service center in different big cities. Of course,if your Chinese is good enough, you can find your girl from this website by yourself.
At last ,I have to specify I am not advertise for this website. I just suggest an more easy and safty way to those western men who already in China.
Here is the information I just got from that website.
November 11 is the big "bachelor" day in China, they will hold a big party in different cities, normally it held in hotel and they will specify how many people attend and even the name of dishes and wine you will eat. It charges you 150RMB/per person. Guangzhou,Ningbo,Guilin has limited ,They are 300 hundreds people attend. But Shenzhen, Shanghai,Shenyang.Hankou(Wuhan) has 1000 people attend.
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Thank you Chen Yan. I've not said welcome to you yet but welcome to out group of friends. You are a very pleasant addition.
Shaun
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Chen Yan that is a good suggestion.
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Didn't I alway's say ... chinese Lady's are very smart . Let's check on the Dashboard ?
Smart Lady's : 228 ( was 227 , but now with Chen .. )
Not so smart Lady's : 7
Dumb Lady's : 1 ( that I know of )
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women that are in their late thirty's and into their forty's are becoming more desperate to find a man and are willing to settle for a man much older than them! Is this true love? I really don't think so! It becomes an issue of lonliness and security!
Jim
[/quote]
Ok...provocative post as always Jim....but there are always 2 sides to this "age" difference arguement.
So a mature woman, say in her late 30's to late 40's will "settle" for an older Western Man because she has little hope of finding a Chinese Man at her age.....and what is wrong with that if BOTH partners accept and understand that this arrangement suits their needs...there are many ways to measure love...especially when you get older...and some of these ways are NOT neccessarily between the sheets !!!!!
I dont think you are correct to categorically condem any relationship that has an age difference.
For instance...what would you "allow" as the difference in age...2 years, 5 years, 10 years...or what. ?? And you are saying here that any mariage betwen two people who DONT match your own perspective of age difference is doomed ??...because until you post a definitive number of years difference, nobody can legitimately respond to your post.
So, Jim...lets hear your CATEGORICAL opinion on the MAXIMUM age difference that can be allowed in a relationship so that it can be considered a valid and long term proposition.
Cheers
DavidE
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Ya might want to re read his comment again before jumping the gun ya know.
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What is wrong with women, your own age??? I would love to hear your answer!
Have a great day bro!
Jim
Nothing is wrong with Australian women of my age (58) but they all are looking for a man to keep them in luxury for the rest of their lives. And if the Men they hook up with is Ok with that...so be it.
If you are a 58 year old Western man with no assets, no money and no prospects...you aint gonna find a Western Woman...that subject has also been done to death here.
Most Western women of 58 years are very much over the hill...mentally, emotionally and physically. Rampant feminism and possession phobia has turned these women into something alien.
Why indeed do you, me or any Man now cast our sights overseas...because the Internet and modern communications means that we CAN.
I dont particularly seek a woman from anywhere based on age alone. When you begin looking in other countries, it is surprising to get so much attention from women who are younger....and maybe they are ALL unprincipalled gold diggers ??....I think not !!
What is very appealing to me (and many others whom I know) is that foreign women...particularly Chinese women retain so much of what is honourable and desirable in a female persona.
I would totally discount any woman of 20 years old who wrote to me..it is inconceivable that this could work. But there has been many quality communications to me from women who you would probably consider to be too young...ie about 15 to 20 years younger than me.
But my Lady is 18 years younger than me, she has 2 degrees, is financially stable, is an intelligent, professional woman with high intellect, high morals and high ethics. She is an Internationally recognised Surgeon.
She has no problems with age difference, I have no problems either. She sure dont want me for my money, she has her own, she sure dont want me because I am a Brad Pitt. So why does she want to continue our relationship to the point of marrage ???....you tell me ???
I think its simple...because we have come to our own conclusions after many, many communications that we are compatible, we have genuine feelings for each other and we are not silly children who got caught up in some sexual fantasy.
So if such an age difference dooms us in your eyes, I want you to tell me why ...because you have got a very big hang- up about this subject.
If there is something i have missed, I want to know about it.
Knowlege is power.
DavidE
Jim placed a number in his post ... he talked about an age difference of 20 years or more, and how that affects the relationship
I know when I started my search I was 47 years old, and I would not even consider a lady under 35...
I felt that 12 years was the most I would want to go, concerning an age difference...
Mike
I do understand your thoughts about this subject..and obviously you did think about it.
You came to your decision that 12 years would be your number...
But let me ask you...if your lady was 13 years younger ???...or 14 years ??...would it have made much difference ??
DavidE
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But then how many men are treating the women the same way.
How often do we hear that someone is coming to China and is intending to meet two three or more women through the agencies.
When a women gets an introduction to a foreigner she has to pay a fee whether it goes further than one date or not. Some agencies are charging them up to 10,000 just for arranging that meeting for the lady and one sent a lady a dated a bill for 20,000 for that meeting!!!
That is a lot of money as we all know what the average wages are here.
So lets be fair to the ladies as well as wanting fairness for ourselves.
So remember if there was no agencies, no translators then Chnlove would not exist. And we would not have this forum and probably we would never have what most others do not have and that is special the love of a chinese lady.
Ok we would all like the agencies to be squeaking clean but it is not going to happen - why because humans are involved. And where humans are involved there will always be those who want that little bit more than anyone else.
(Am I getting indoctrinated or what!!!!!)
Willy
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Who was that last post? :angel:
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Let me get in in here.
OK I am one of the eldest on this site and I admit to being 60. Since arriving here in June I have been out with girls in their 20's and 30's and 40s.
But would I marry one of those in their 20's or 30's the answer is no. Although I intend to live in China there will be times when I have to return to the UK and would I want to be seen walking arm in arm with someone half or even more than half my age - no I would not feel comfortable with that or the comments that we may receive as a result becase in the UK there is prejudice on just about everything - race, age, colour sex.
In China it is no problem as I am stared at where ever I go so what is the difference if I have a beautiful lady with me or not and as far as I know no one has made any derisory comments at all.
But in UK that would be different.
So I have settled on a lady who is 14 years younger than me and who who treats me like no other has ever done in my entire previous 60 years. We have been living together for a while and it is great.
Would I give that up - never.
No one can say you should have age gap no more than 'x' amount of years that is up to the individuals concerned. If they are happy with the difference then great, if not then they should look elsewhere.
Willy
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Good for you Willy. I am happy for you.
Here I am obsessing over a 16 year difference with me and a woman I am talking with on another site.
Shaun
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As I said on another thread Shaun - if you both feel ok about it then go for it.
Willy
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So, a funny thing happened today. I got an emf from Lianne (the girl that i was writing to that started this thread) It's been two weeks since our final communication. She was just saying hello and was asking how i was, and although i said we could no longer be lovers, i did say she still had a friend here. I only had two credits left on my account and said i would like to stay in contact, and i also explained to her how the emf system works for us guy's. (cost etc) I mentioned that i was no longer going to bother with Chnlove and after my reply i would only have one credit left which she could use in replying to me. I said i would like to stay in touch, but as no longer would be buying credits, she would have to give me some contact information on how i could write to her if she wanted to continue any kind of correspondence with me. I included my email and mobile number in my emf to her. She did reply the next day saying she did not really expect to here from me again, but was happy i did. She thanked me for sending her my other contact details and said she would try to contact me in the future thru these methods. But funnily enough, she did not provide me with any way of contacting her. (email, which i know she has, or mobile number) Hmm, was this a genuine reply, or just the agency trying to get the last few emf's out of me? Who knows? I guess if i get an email from her, then it was a genuine message, if not, it must have been the agency phishing for a few more emf credits.....
Andy.