China Romance
General Discussion and Useful Links => The Campfire => Topic started by: Arnold on July 20, 2010, 11:37:25 am
-
Though I share this with you all . Life is so care-free .
No wonder more folks are dying from cancer than ever before. We wonder where this stuff comes from but here is an example that explains a lot of the cancer causing incidents. Hmmm. Many people are in their cars first thing in the morning and the last thing at night, 7 days a week. As I read this, it makes me feel guilty and ill. Please pass this on to as many people as possible. Guess its not too late to make some changes
Car A/C (Air Conditioning) MUST READ!!!
Please do NOT turn on A/C as soon as you enter the car.
Open the windows after you enter your car and turn ON the AC after a couple of minutes.
Here's why:
According to a research, the car dashboard, sofa, air freshener emit Benzene, a Cancer causing toxin (carcinogen - take time to observe the smell of heated plastic in your car).
In addition to causing cancer, Benzene poisons your bones, causes anemia and reduces white blood cells.
Prolonged exposure will cause Leukemia, increasing the risk of cancer.
Can also cause miscarriage.
Acceptable Benzene level indoors is 50 mg per sq. ft. A car parked indoors with windows closed will contain 400-800 mg of Benzene.
If parked outdoors under the sun at a temperature above 60 degrees F, the Benzene level goes up to 2000-4000 mg, 40 times the acceptable level.
People who get into the car, keeping windows closed will inevitably inhale, in quick succession, excessive amounts of the toxin.
Benzene is a toxin that affects your kidney and liver.. What's worse, it is extremely difficult for your body to expel this toxic stuff.
So friends, please open the windows and door of your car - give time for interior to air out -dispel the20deadly stuff - before you enter.
-
Not to worry here I always open the windows first to let the heat out (get some air flowing) then turn the AC on and the windows stay open a couple of inches until it starts to cool. Just habit.
-
Where did this information come from? It sounds terrible and there should be some kind of warning.
-
Shaun , the info came from Arnold .
haha , my German Aunt E-mailed it to me yesterday .
-
Shaun,
Benzene is a carcinogen. It has been well documented for a long time now as a cancer causing agent. It is a primary ingredient in the "new car small" that you can smell when you first get into the car. Where I worked in the automobile assembly plant I worked in we got the vehicles with the doors closed and the windows up. Our safety instructions from compensation and management was to open the door and wait a couple seconds for some fresh air to get into the vehicle before getting into it to drive it. They have known about it for a long time. Most people only have exposure to it for a couple minutes a couple times a day. We would have exposure to it for 8 or more hours 5 or 6 days a week. Thats why we were warned about it. :o
You want to have as much information as possible to try to avoid any health risk you may be exposed to. Thanks for the warning Arnold. Every little bit helps. ;)
Dave C
-
thats an interesting post. i always rolled the windows half way down and then turned the air on
but not on full and a few minutes later rolled the windows up as i was driving along. so i hope this
helped with this. but i didnt do it because i knew these things
-
OK. I am a firm believer that one should study the facts from a reliable source and one should check many sources of information. I don't doubt what Arnold or Dave C said I just like to look at it for myself.
-
I thought an air conditioner was what kept my locks a natural dark color and so soft and silky to the touch.
Willy
-
OK. I am a firm believer that one should study the facts from a reliable source and one should check many sources of information. I don't doubt what Arnold or Dave C said I just like to look at it for myself.
Shaun, relax a bit, they were not talking about WD 40 or duct tape. buzz
-
Buzz you crack me up. I am choosy what drugs I intentionally allow to go into my body. :D
-
As recognised Carcinogens, Benzene, Xylene and Toluene have been banned in Manufacturing processes for 15 years.
It is unlikely that there are any traces of these chemicals in the "new car smell", or in fact the normal smell of car upholstery, dashboard and other plastic components.
The smell is due to the Glycol based plasticisers used in the manufacturing process to stop the seats and dash from going brittle too quickly.
Additionally, there will be a very slight trace of unreacted Vinyl Monomer in the PVC used in the seating materials. (unless you have leather seats of course) !!
This is an old furphy from way back...has no basis in reality.
If we want to get serious about carcinogens...better start looking hard at the radiation from mobile phones/phone towers, of which we are getting more and more exposed to every day...and its getting worse !! There is little doubt that the level of low grade microwaves from these devices is playing hell with our DNA...never put a mobile phone to your ear..use hands-free.
-
I am not trying to say anything untowards here guy's BUT....God I wish I was as intelligent as a lot of the people on this site... :)
This is what I love about it, you learn so much about so many things...WOW KEEP it up gents, as the lady said to the vicar...hehe
-
David E,
Toluene is still used in the clear coat paint on your vehicle at the factory, although it is greatly reduced from the old days. The Material Safety Data Sheet we were given still lists toluene in the clear coat paint. (1998 or 1999 was the last year I saw the sheet) The water bourne paint, glycol based, is only the colour.
As a side note, they use propane to make the seat foam. Every time you would get into the vehicle, for the first several times, you could smell propane. It took a while before we found out propane was used to make the foam. You are not supposed to breath that stuff either.
Dave C
PS
I could not remember that they called the clear coat paint a solvent bourne paint until this morning so I am adding that now.
Dave C
-
It could be worse, you could have been staying at the Swan hotel in the early eighties like this guy was............
The Swan Hotel in Harbin, China is a true Chinese owned (by the government), Chinese operated and Chinese controlled hotel. They have many rules and none of them are to be ignored or bent in the slightest way. After my room assignment, I lugged my own bags to the elevator, surprised to find an elevator operator sitting inside the doors on a stool. This was my first example of the Chinese theory that everybody had to have a job. She pointed up with a question on her face. I looked at the array of buttons and realized we were on the bottom floor.
"We can only go up," I said. "Fourth floor, please." She replied something in Mandarin and pointed up a second time. This time I nodded and held up four fingers. She smiled and pushed the button. We were met by a scary looking Chinese lady dressed in a sweat suit with a picture of Mickey Mouse on it, only on her shirt it was "Miky Muse". Something must have gotten lost in the translation. Our interpreter appeared at her side.
"This girl is in charge of the floor. She will take you to your room. You are in 409. I am in 412," Charles, my government guide informed me."Just give me the key. I'm sure I can find the room," I answered. "You don't get a key here. She'll unlock the door for you. It locks automatically when the door shuts."
"So, every time I come back to my room, she has to open it?"........."Yes."
I found the inside of the room like no other hotel room I had ever experienced. The ceiling was at least twelve feet tall and the once white lace curtains over the window were a dark gray, torn and barely still hanging on the bent curtain rods. The carpet was wrinkled and covered with cigarette burns, some of them still sporting the remains of the cigarette butts. There were missing plates over the electrical plug and bare wires exposed. One wire was twisted around another and made its way to the TV sitting on the floor under a picture of a fruit bowl. Don't touch that baby, she's loaded with 220 volts, I reminded my self.
Sitting beside the TV was a large thermos bottle filled with boiling hot water. "Use it for tea and brushing your teeth," ordered Charles, and then he was gone. The door was shut by the Floor Lady and I found my self alone. Walking to the window, I scrapped off some ice and dirt in order to see what was outside. I wish I hadn't done that. It appeared the hotel had been built in the middle of a garbage dump.
I tried the bed, discovering the five inch thick cover. Did I mention the hotel had no heat and it was below freezing inside as well as outside? After some exertion, I was able to turn back the cover to find a bean filled pillow. I was hoping it was beans, anyway. Next, I went into the bathroom and attempted to turn on the light. Nothing happened. Great... the bulb had burned out.
Blocking the door open to avoid having to face Miky, I headed for room 412."Charles, go see the floor lady and get me a light bulb for the bathroom, please," I said, returning to my room to wait. A few minutes later, Charles was back, Miky in tow. "She says the hotel is out of light bulbs. They have been on order for three months," Charles informed me. "You're kidding me, right? They can't go to the store a buy a light bulb?"......."Guess not."
"Well, have her take a bulb from another room and replace mine." Charles let go with a barrage of Mandarin. Miky responded in kind. "She can't do that. That would make the room un-functional." "Yeah... well, my room is un-functional," I nearly yelled. He translated. "Yes, but she didn't cause it. She says it is okay to take the bulb back and forth from room to room, but don't drop it. Remember, they are out of bulbs."I was having a hard time believing this conversation. "Okay, then move me to another room. The bathroom is so dark I can't find the toilet." He translated. "Sorry... once a room is assigned, they can't change it. You will have to see the manager. He'll be in tomorrow."
I sat on the bed, put my face in my hands and pretended to cry. Actually, I almost didn't have to pretend. Miky left. Charles smiled. "Dinner is in an hour. We are having a welcome banquet at the Mayor's favorite restaurant. I'll knock you up." Obviously, he learned his English from a true Brit. So, for the next four days, the light bulb was moved back and forth as needed. I was very careful not to drop it.
This incident was typical of the frustrations one faced when trying to deal with the Chinese people. They were given a set of rules by their superiors, and they didn't deviate from them... no matter how illogical the situation was.
We don't know how lucky we are now!
-
Dave C
Without wishing to get "nit-picky" on such a complex Technical and Chemical subject, the use of toluene in top-coat laquers...particulary clear coats, has been banned internationally since 1986. Although I think some of the Indian car manufacturers are still using these "Benzene ring" compounds as solvent carriers for the U/V stabilised top-coats.
Since it was discovered that the "Benzene Ring" or "organic aromatics" were carcinogens, due much to the revelations about DDT and Dieldrin et al, their use has been banned under many National and Global Statutes.
All of the Benzene, Toluene and Xylene based solvents are primarily derivatives of the Benzene ring structure, which is the one that does the damage (we have no phisiological or genetic capability within our human systems to dispose of these ring structures...they are man-made and thus alien to our immune system)..so they just go round and round inside us, doing damage !!! and ultimately get "parked" in fatty tissues and liver.
As for blowing, or foaming agents within uphostery foams, the use of hydrocarbons (propane etc) has ben phased out over the past 10 years because they are severe "greenhouse" emitters and Ozone destroyers.
Of greater concern is the level of Isocyanates that are used as substitute blowing agents...these buggers are a WHOLE lot more toxic to humans then the Hydrocarbons they replaced...but they are more friendly to the environment...go figure !!!!
The motor industry (particularly in the developed countries has been extrordinary responsible in the use of toxic chemicals in manufacturing their product. So I am not convinced that Cars are where the danger is.
Sooner or later, Industry will need to have a serious look at the curing agents for Particle, Chip and MDF fibreboards we use in our homes that give out a steady and constant dribble of formaldehyde...and you know what that is used for !!!!...embalming bodies and "pickling" bio-specimens
-
Paul,
now that was an interesting funny story that could still happen today. even my wife laughed at it.
now wouldnt it be interesting if China implemented MDS sheets for eveything that would be
something.
-
I think that's a long way off yet Ted :)
As we didn't have enough to worry about, after his stay at the Swan Hotel his visit to a Chinese factory was also an eye opener :-\
The name of the factory was Harbin Tractor Works. Actually, Harbin's tractor didn't work... not very well, anyway. After nearly thirty years of working for the world leader in quality earthmoving equipment, I was shocked beyond belief at the product the Harbin Tractor Works was turning out their back door. I'm sure I will never be able to find the words to describe properly what we saw. However, I will try.
We first toured the sheet metal department... the place where they make fenders, hoods and such. The impression that sticks in my mind was the rust. Every piece of metal in the huge room was covered in heavy rust. The floor was covered with trash, scrap parts and a maze of acetylene torch hoses and sledge hammers. There were no presses. There were no dies. This was definitely a "Heat and Beat" shop. The next impression that has stayed with me over all these years... no two parts were the same. In fact, they were so different, they could not be stacked.
The frame area came next. There were no holding fixtures for the weld fabrications. The welder held the different parts in place with C-clamps or by hand as he welded them together. Nothing was measured. Also, as in the sheet metal department, every part was covered with rust. There was no evidence of any engineering drawings. There was no evidence of any weld procedures or assembly instructions. I was told that these welders had been doing the same job so long that they knew where each of the different parts goes. I noticed the size of the welds ranged from 1/8 to 3/4 of an inch... in the same joint. Therefore, the frames were warped and deflected in every direction. Because of this, they had a number of straightening presses where the operators tried to get the frame back in some dimensional conformance. This didn't work very well.
In the assembly area, there appeared to be no logical order of things. Similar parts were all over the room, as three or four workers tried to find pieces they could fit together without too much banging and cutting. Since no two parts were the same, this process sometimes took several minutes before compatible parts could be found. Rust was still the favorite color. I watched as they installed the tires on one unit and pushed it to the next area to have the engine installed. The tractor listed to the left, the right side at least four inches higher than the left. When I questioned our guide, he informed me this was a normal condition, that this would have no bearing on the function of the tractor. Function being the key word here.
Our next stop was the paint shop. If I hadn't seen it with my own eyes, I wouldn't have believed it. The tractors were being painted by hand... with a brush... over the rust... with no masking tape... by girls wearing dresses and high heel shoes. The body of the tractors was bright red and the tires and wheels were painted black. There were no decals. There was no chrome. The seats were made from thin plastic that had torn and cracked, revealing the dried grass that had been used for stuffing. In short, the units looked as if they had been made in a back yard garage by ten year olds hoping to win the derby. No two units looked the same.
The test area revealed my worst fears. The tractors performed terribly. If the unit was fortunate enough to be started, it was driven to a pile of loose dirt where, now get this, six workers filled the bucket with dirt using long handled shovels. Then the bucket was slowly raised. Once it attained the proper height, the tractor was put into gear and driven thirty feet away to another dirt pile. It was stopped, and the bucket was dropped, dumping the load. If the tractor completed this test, it was driven over to the shipping department.
"May I offer a suggestion?" I asked the head of the test area. "Why don't you have the operator lower the bucket, drive into the pile of dirt to fill it, and then lift it and go to the dump pile? Why do you have the workers filling it by hand?"
"We have ample hydraulic power to lift the bucket. We have ample hydraulic power to move the machine from one place to another. We do not have enough hydraulic power to do both at the same time."
"Oh... well... okay then."
What we observed that day was typical of similar factories all over China, although there was a few who did some things better. The factory leaders were told how many units to manufacture each month by the government. Then they were loaded onto rail cars, and the rail cars disappeared. The people who built the machines had no idea where they went nor who the users were. They had no feed back from the user, thus they had no idea how the units performed or what idea what they liked or dislike about the tractors. There was no such thing as warranties.
Now we knew why the Chinese government was willing to pay our company a substantial amount of money for a transfer of twenty year old technology. They wanted to learn how to make tractors that we made twenty years ago. If successful, they would have advanced their own manufacturing by fifty years. I knew one thing for sure. It wasn't going to happen over night... and I would end up making several trips to China. At that moment in time, I wasn't sure if I liked that idea or not.
-
Great story Paul. Keep the flow of words coming as we are all pulling for you ;D
-
Paul, (wait a second... so I can pick my jaw up off the floor) I can't understand why anyone (even in management) hasn't thought how to speed up production? Like having presses, or jigs for the welding, etc? And the painting? Come on! Even the last house I did remodeling I had sprayers come in.
-
Vince they have a huge labor pool there.If it is a government run factory.They have to put the masses to work.So if it takes a couple of girls wearing dresses and high heeled shoes so be it..It is the same in every grocery store I have Ben to in China.There are at least three people standing at the end of a isle.Waiting to assist you.Every grocery store I have Ben to in China.Their is usually more employees.Then they are customers.Restraunts and massage parlors Are the same way.If you don't have 6 waitresses bringing you food and drink.And waiting on you hand and foot.There is something wrong.
Most companies in China.Have way to much help.It has nothing to do with efficiency or cost cutting measures.It is called keeping the masses employed and happy.If your unemployment rate is to high in a communist country like China.The other countries give you a hard time.And the masses began to get angry.Because there is no work.Then the next thing you know.You have Revelation in the air.Beijing can't tolerate anymore revolts.So having to many employees.Has become the normal opperating procedure.
As far as the quality of the tractor.those tractors are not for export.They will probably be used by the military or the government.If a farmer does get a hold of one.Who is he going to complain to?The government? The company that built the tractor?All they are going to do is tell him there is no warranty.So he is stuck with it.
Last time I looked.I didn't see any John deers.Ore any other western made tractors.So I don't think that they import very many.Their fore there is no competition.
As for having welding jigs.and the proper equipment.To do the job right.That is a luxury item in China.And it costs money.Money that the company owner.Or the government cannot stick in There pockets.Most government companies.And some of the private companies operate with a huge overhead.Along with all the regular bills.You have to pay to own a company. If you own a factory in China.Ore a restraunt.You are obligated to feed.And house your employees.I don't know how much of the profit that takes.But I would imagine that it cuts into your profits allot.
-
Maxx,
the massage parlors have to many people working???? mmmm does you wife know that you know this lol lol!!!!!
-
Yes Ted she Does.My wife and her friends are the ones that take me to them.There is a real high dollar place in Zhongshan.It is probably the best foot massage.In Goungdong province.You should ask Willy he can probably tell you where it is.
I don't know about the other kind of massage parlors in China.Ted maybe you can enlighten us.Since you Willy and Shaun are always talking about Viagra.I think while your wives are working. You all are visiting the other kind of massage places.Come on Ted.Do you have something to tell us.
-
dont use the stuff sorry to inform you just buy for willy and shaun. its a well known fact they are all over the
place here and ktv have bed rental rooms also. they just shut one down by the garden hotel. more prevelant
in the smaller towns
-
Paul's last post was a follow on from the first talking about 1980's , glad things have improved since then , regards Robert.
-
I used to get frustrated by this but now im just amused with these two things
1----- people in business stop what they are doing to answer there cell phones or texts and then resume
waiting on you
2----- if your in line and someone else asks a question they move on to answer that then come back to help you
these used to drive me livid but i see its just the way it is and now im used to it
-
Wow, did anyone get the tag number of that bus? ya'll is just brutal. :D
-
we blew the horn????? lol!!!!!
-
I understand keeping many people working and this could be done in updating production also. If presses and jigs are used the cost (material) is less. They may have to pay for the press but put against the cost of the propane they use to heat the metal to pound out? A jig would have a lower welding cost. Same with painting, spraying the paint uses less paint then brushing. For me finding a easier/faster way of production is second nature. I've done it all my life. It gets noticed when I give suggestions on a job. Which is the reason why I almost always make a supervisor position in three months time. Ah the good old days....
-
Researchers concerned by gender-bending fish Module body
Thu Jul 29, 9:55 PM
By Shannon Montgomery, The Canadian Press
CALGARY - Alberta researchers say gender-bending fish swimming in the province's southern rivers raise serious questions about whether the water is safe for people to drink.
Two University of Calgary professors have been studying how a small species of minnow reacts to a wide variety of hormone-altering chemicals detected in several rivers.
They found sexual changes both in the wild populations of the fish and under controlled lab experiments with the same chemicals, said co-author Hamid Habibi.
He said while it's not known whether the levels are high enough to hurt humans, there is a possible risk the chemicals could increase cancer rates or developmental abnormalities.
"We think there's a health concern," he said Thursday. "We'd like to be able to predict these things and reduce that kind of risk."
In some locations, female fish accounted for as much as 90 per cent of the minnow population, far higher than the normal 55 to 60 per cent.
At many of the sites studied, male fish showed elevated levels of a protein normally high only in the blood of females. Other areas have produced male fish with female eggs in their testes.
Habibi and co-author Lee Jackson found a large variety of chemicals that affect hormones in the water. They include synthetic estrogens, such as the birth control pill and bisphenol A — a chemical used in making plastics — as well as agricultural byproducts.
The disturbances in fish populations were greater downstream from cities than upstream and were most notable around several major cattle feedlots.
One area of high concentration was interrupted by a normal region where the river is joined by several tributaries from Waterton National Park.
The researchers managed to replicate many of the changes in a lab environment by combining the chemicals in the same ratio as found in the river.
They also discovered that while a single chemical might affect a fish one way, the combined effect with another chemical might be much greater than expected.
In one case, two chemicals might each have a one-fold effect on a fish, while in combination the effect might be nine times bigger.
"The potency of these chemicals improves significantly if they are present in a mixture. That is new information," said Habibi.
"Which means some of the data used by Health Canada and EPA (the Environmental Protection Agency in the United States) may need to be revised, because they're based on individual studies for those chemicals."
Jackson said most wastewater treatment plants don't get rid of many of the chemicals.
The researchers have partnered with the City of Calgary to begin work at a new treatment plant investigating how engineering can keep the chemicals from flowing back into the water.
He said it's too early to tell whether the current levels in water might have anything to do with a rising trend of cancers that are under hormonal control, but he added that a possible link should be studied.
"I think we need to look at this a little more carefully and ask, what is the message the fish are telling us," he said.
"If the fish are showing bent genders and people are drinking the same water ... we need to try to evaluate that risk."
Part of the research is to be published in the journal Environmental Toxicology and Chemistry.
-
Evolution is being distorted by pollution, which damages genitals and the ability to father offspring, says new study.
The male gender is in danger, with incalculable consequences for both humans and wildlife, startling scientific research from around the world reveals.
The research the most comprehensive report yet published – shows that a host of common chemicals is feminising males of every class of vertebrate animals, from fish to mammals, including people.Backed by some of the world's leading scientists, who say that it "waves a red flag" for humanity and shows that evolution itself is being disrupted by "gender-bending" polutants.It also follows hard on the heels of new American research which shows that baby boys born to women exposed to widespread chemicals in pregnancy are born with smaller penises and feminised genitals."This research shows that the basic male tool kit is under threat," says Gwynne Lyons, a former government adviser on the health effects of chemicals, who wrote the report.
Wildlife and people have been exposed to more than 100,000 new chemicals in recent years, and the European Commission has admitted that 99 per cent of them are not adequately regulated. There is not even proper safety information on 85 per cent of them.Many have been identified as "endocrine disrupters" – or gender-benders – because they interfere with hormones. These include phthalates, used in food wrapping, cosmetics and baby powders among other applications; flame retardants in furniture and electrical goods; PCBs, a now banned group of substances still widespread in food and the environment; and many pesticides.
Fish, it says, are particularly affected by pollutants as they are immersed in them when they swim in contaminated water, taking them in not just in their food but through their gills and skin. They were among the first to show widespread gender-bending effects.Even more ominously for humanity, mammals have also been found to be widely affected.
Two-thirds of male Sitka black-tailed deer in Alaska have been found to have undescended testes and deformed antler growth, and roughly the same proportion of white-tailed deer in Montana were discovered to have genital abnormalities.In South Africa, eland have been revealed to have damaged testicles while being contaminated by high levels of gender-bender chemicals, and striped mice from one polluted nature reserved were discovered to be producing no sperm at all.
At the other end of the world, hermaphrodite polar bears – with penises and vaginas – have been discovered and gender-benders have been found to reduce sperm counts and penis lengths in those that remained male. Many of the small, endangered populations of Florida panthers have been found to have abnormal sperm. Other research has revealed otters from polluted areas with smaller testicles and mink exposed to PCBs with shorter penises. Beluga whales in Canada's St Lawrence estuary and killer whales off its north-west coast – two of the wildlife populations most contaminated by PCBs – are reproducing poorly, as are exposed porpoises, seals and dolphins.
Dr Pete Myers, chief scientist at Environmental Health Sciences, one of the world's foremost authorities on gender-bender chemicals, added: "We have thrown 100, 000 chemicals against a finely balanced hormone system, so it's not surprising that we are seeing some serious results. It is leading to the most rapid pace of evolution in the history of the world. Professor Lou Gillette of Florida University, one of the most respected academics in the field, warned that the report waved "a large red flag" at humanity. He said: "If we are seeing problems in wildlife, we can be concerned that something similar is happening to a proportion of human males"Indeed, new research at the University of Rochester in New York state shows that boys born to mothers with raised levels of phthalates were more likely to have smaller penises and undescended testicles. They also had a shorter distance between their anus and genitalia, a classic sign of feminisation. And a study at Rotterdam's Erasmus University showed that boys whose mothers had been exposed to PCBs grew up wanting to play with dolls and tea sets rather than with traditionally male toys.
Communities heavily polluted with gender-benders in Canada, Russia and Italy have given birth to twice as many girls than boys, which may offer a clue to the reason for a mysterious shift in sex ratios worldwide. Normally 106 boys are born for every 100 girls, but the ratio is slipping. It is calculated that 250,000 babies who would have been boys have been born as girls instead in the US and Japan alone and sperm counts are dropping precipitously. Studies in more than 20 countries have shown that they have dropped from 150 million per millilitre of sperm fluid to 60 million over 50 years. (Hamsters produce nearly three times as much, at 160 million.) Professor Nil Basu of Michigan University says that this adds up to "pretty compelling evidence for effects in humans".
-
mans foremost foe is HIMSELF we are slowly destroying ourselves and everything else around us
above us and under us
-
I found this and thought it said a lot about the world we all live in. The attitude of manufacturing workers every where, of which I have been one on occasion and the culture clash as east meets west on the workshop floor. It's not meant to be anti American but more about the stuff we all don't seem to be able to live without. So remember the slogan " 'No more insane flying toys for Western pigs!' next time you go shopping .................................................................
Chinese Factory Worker Can't Believe The Shit He Makes For Americans ( and the rest of us too!)
FENGHUA, CHINA—Chen Hsien, an employee of Fenghua Ningbo Plastic Works Ltd., a plastics factory that manufactures lightweight household items for Western markets, expressed his disbelief Monday over the "sheer amount of shit Americans will buy." "Often, when we're assigned a new order for, say, 'salad shooters,' I will say to myself, 'There's no way that anyone will ever buy these,'" Chen said during his lunch break in an open-air courtyard. "One month later, we will receive an order for the same product, but three times the quantity. How can anyone have a need for such useless shit?"
Chen, 23, who has worked as an injection-mold operator at the factory since it opened in 2006, said he frequently asks himself these questions during his workweek, which exceeds 60 hours and earns him the equivalent of $81."I hear that Americans can buy anything they want, and I believe it, judging from the things I've made for them," Chen said. "And I also hear that, when they no longer want an item, they simply throw it away. So wasteful and contemptible."
Among the items that Chen has helped create are plastic-bag dispensers, microwave omelet cookers, glow-in-the-dark page magnifiers, Christmas-themed file baskets, animal-shaped contact-lens cases, and adhesive-backed wall hooks. "Sometimes, an item the factory produces resembles nothing I've ever seen," Chen said. "One time, we made something that looked like a ladle, but it had holes in its cup and a handle that bent down 90 degrees. The foreman told us that it was a soda-can holder for an automobile. If you are lucky enough to own a car, sit back and enjoy the journey. Save the soda beverage for later."Chen added: "A cup holder is not a necessary thing to own."
Chen expressed similar confusion over the tens of thousands of pineapple corers, plastic eyeshades, toothpick dispensers, and dog pull-toys that he has helped manufacture."Why the demand for so many kitchen gadgets?" Chen said. "I can understand having a good wok, a rice cooker, a tea kettle, a hot plate, some utensils, good china, a teapot with a strainer, and maybe a thermos. But all these extra things—where do the Americans put them? How many times will you use a taco-shell holder? 'Oh, I really need this silverware-drawer sorter or I will have fits.' Shut up, stupid American." Chen added that many of the items break after only a few uses."None are built to last very long," Chen said. "That is probably so the Americans can return to buy more. Not even the badly translated assembly instructions deter them. If I bought a kitchen item that came with such poor Mandarin instructions, I would return the item immediately."
May Gao of the Hong Kong-based labor-advocacy group China Labour Bulletin said complaints like Chen's are common among workers in China's bustling industrial cities."Last week, I took testimony from several young female workers from Shenzhen who said they were locked in a work room for 18 straight hours making inflatable Frisbees," Gao said. "Finally, the girls joined hands on the factory floor and began to chant, 'No more insane flying toys for Western pigs!' They quickly lost their jobs and were ostracized by their families, but the incident was a testament to China's growing disillusionment with producing needless crap for fat-ass foreigners."Continued Gao: "As Chinese manufacturing and foreign investment continue to grow, and more silly novelty products are invented, we can expect to see more of these protests."
In the meantime, Chen continues to stew in bitterness. Though he dislikes his work, competition for manufacturing jobs in Fenghua is stiff and he must support his wife, mother, and 2-year-old son."My cousin Yuen is self-employed," Chen said. "He disassembles old computers that are acquired from overseas and extracts the traces of valuable gold and silver from the circuit boards. He asked me to join him. The work is very toxic, but at least I would not be looking at suction-cup razor holders and jumbo-dice keychains all day."
Chen added: "For now, I must refuse the job. Somehow, the only thing more depressing than making plastic shit for Americans is destroying the plastic shit they send back."
Saying all that I do love this
Now what was I talking about? oh yes, buying useless crap ::)
-
I gave to agree with him? I say the same thing... people buy this crap?
-
so i would ascertain that the USA is the only market for these things??? sounds to me like he just
doesnt like the USA and that is his right and his opinion. he does make a living to support his family
from making these items so maybe he just needs to be grateful for that and not put down a country
in specific.
-
I tend to agree with Ted on this.If the guy doesn't like the job just quit.I heard the other day.Those Chinese coal mines.Are always looking for help.It is the same thing for those woman that protested at the factory.If you don't like the job fined another one.If you don't like the working conditions.In the shitty factory your working in.Then rise up as a unified group of workers.And protest together.Oh my bad.I almost forgot the last time somebody tried to change the Chinese work environment.They got shot or arrested for causing problems.
I think these people need to wake up.And thank thiere god every mourning.That they have a job.A way to support themselves and thiere families.If they think they have it to tough.They can always live on the street.And see how tough it really is.
As far as this article goes.Most people don't know it is bad.Until somebody tells them it is bad.You can think you have the greatest life the greatest job.Then somebody comes along and tells you you have a shitty life a shitty job.Then all of the sudden your life sucks.Your job sucks.Nobody respects you.The neighbors dog hates you.What it all comes down to.Is whoever wrote this article.Thinks he or she.Has a shitty job and a shitty life.So everybody around them.Should be in the same state of mind.
I'm sure whoever wrote this article.Will never be asked to come back to the factories.And do another article.All these kind of articles do is breed hate and discontent.Then production falls off.People missing work rises.If the company doesn't deal with this kind of nonsense.And get rid of the unhappy employee.It can close the factory.Then you have got 800 to 900 people out of work.Just because of the writers righteous indignation.
Without China's huge export market.What do you think would happen.To China's booming economy.It would be like.It was back in the 60's and 70's again.No money no jobs.The Chinese government.Would have a revolution on thiere hands again.And it would have to go back.To the old hard line communist government mentality again.And we have all seen where that got them.And where it got Russia,Cuba,North Korea,Cambodia,Lao,Vietnam.And Burma.
I think they should just smile.And not complain about all the work.The western world gives them.And remember where the money for the food and the clothes.And all the other stuff.Is comming from
-
I tend to agree with Ted on this.If the guy doesn't like the job just quit.I heard the other day.Those Chinese coal mines.Are always looking for help.It is the same thing for those woman that protested at the factory.If you don't like the job fined another one.If you don't like the working conditions.In the shitty factory your working in.Then rise up as a unified group of workers.And protest together.Oh my bad.I almost forgot the last time somebody tried to change the Chinese work environment.They got shot or arrested for causing problems.the food and the clothes.And all the other stuff.Is comming from
I understand that it sometimes happens to those who pronounce such a course in public as Forums!!!! When is your next visit to China Maxx?
Willy
-
Willy what does that mean???? im lost on the comment???? you made to Maxx
-
The wife and kids probably will go in April or May.I probably won't go this year.
-
what part of china will they go to Maxx??? just curious
-
Fly into Beijing.Then take the train to JiuJiang.It is about a 12 hour train ride.They will take the night train so they can sleep.
-
if they can get the private sleeper much much better
-
Just wondering if anybody knows of this in the US ?
# on your telephone -
I dialed '0', to check this out, asked the operator, who confirmed that this was correct
so please pass it on . . . (l also checked out Snopes.com. This is true, and also applies to cell phones!)
PASS ON TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW
I received a telephone call last evening from an individual identifying himself as an AT&T Service Technician (could also be Telus) who was conducting a test on the telephone lines. He stated that to complete the test I should touch nine(9), zero(0), the pound sign (#), and then hang up. Luckily, I was suspicious and refused.
Upon contacting the telephone company, I was informed that by pushing 90#, you give the requesting individual full access to your telephone line, which enables them to place long distance calls billed to your home phone number.
I was further informed that this scam has been originating from many local jails/prisons DO NOT press 90# for ANYONE..
The GTE Security Department requested that I share this information with EVERYONE I KNOW.
After checking with Verizon they also said it was true, so do not dial 90# for anyone !!!!!
-
I dialed '0', to check this out, asked the operator, who confirmed that this was correct
so please pass it on . . . (l also checked out Snopes.com. This is true, and also applies to cell phones!)
Old News and speaking of Snoops, Here's what they really said.....
-
thats good one if it is coming out of a prison but the others are probably from everywere
good to know but dont have a house phone in china just cell phones
-
First let me say, those were probably not BEANS in that pillow - although they would like you to think so, living so close to a dump, they were more likely
"smart pills" from the mice....lol :o
and since you were in china (where everything is made anyway) you could have taken the lightbulb down the street and had it repaired. The rest of them are
probably on a train heading for a dollar store near you....lol lol ;)
curious though...do the chinese have a dollar store and if so, do they really charge a dollar? hummmm
-
all around Guangzhou they have 2 rmb stores were everything is 2 rmb.
so i guess you could call them the 33 cent store.
-
Then I guess that store does make Cents ::)
-
and it would be centless not to go there and look ::)
-
More than a dozen female political advisors have urged the government to tighten up examination of marriage applications involving Chinese women and foreign nationals to better protect the rights and interests of those women who blunder into unhappy wedlocks.
"In recent years, Chinese embassies and consulates on foreign soils often receive complaints from Chinese women married to foreign nationals, who are subject to domestic violence, sex abuses and even illegal confinement by their husbands," said Ren Yuanzheng, a member of the 10th National Committee of the Chinese People's Political Consultative Conference (CPPCC), China's top advisory body in its annual full session here.
Ren said loopholes in China's existing laws and regulations regarding foreign marriages are one of the factors to blame for the lack of adequate protection of those women.
According to Ren, the current regulations on Chinese-foreigner marriages only require the foreign national involved to present documents of personal identification, but fail to check the income status of the foreign national or whether the couple can afford a stable marriage life.
"Due to the cultural and wealth gap between the Chinese women and their foreign husbands, their marriages are often prone to various misunderstandings and conflicts. As many of the Chinese wives lack the self-protection awareness and are too shy to tell their sad stories to others, they often face escalating violence and maltreatment from their foreign husbands," said Ren.
Ren, along with 16 other female CPPCC members, has submitted a proposal to the ongoing session, calling for stricter examination of foreign marriage applications by relevant government departments.
"We demand the foreign national involved in such a marriage application be required to present his taxation documents or assets evaluation papers, to prove that he has a normal income sufficient for supporting a normal marriage life," said Ren.
The foreign applicant should also deliver a letter of guarantee, pledging to pay the return airfare for the Chinese wife once the couple seek a divorce, and to cover basic living expenses of the wife before a court verdict on the divorce is passed upon, she added. :-\
-
According to Ren, the current regulations on Chinese-foreigner marriages only require the foreign national involved to present documents of personal identification, but fail to check the income status of the foreign national or whether the couple can afford a stable marriage life.
"We demand the foreign national involved in such a marriage application be required to present his taxation documents or assets evaluation papers, to prove that he has a normal income sufficient for supporting a normal marriage life,"
Very interesting Paul, was going through the 47SP and 40SP (Australian migration applications) and I need to provide 2 years worth of group certificates for income tax or that I have atleast been employed for the past 2 years. I will be taking copies over in September so if they require them when we get married in February they will be there anyway. So for me this is not an issue, the only concern I have is what is a normal married life anyway?
-
"We demand the foreign national involved in such a marriage application be required to present his taxation documents or assets evaluation papers, to prove that he has a normal income sufficient for supporting a normal marriage life," said Ren.
So tell me, who is it that will be setting the "normal income" levels to live a "normal married life"? Will this be compared to a normal life in China or a normal life in the country the wife goes to.....? I could go on and on asking these type of questions but I think everybody will get the point.
I am sorry but I have always had trouble with this type of thinking. I understand that the government wants to protect their citizens but I don't think this is the way to do it.
Dave C
-
As always, it will be the few bad apples that get all of us a bad name. I am sure that some foreign brides get themselves married to men who think they are aquiring a slave and maybe also a worker bee who will get a job and support them...not to mention the physical and emotional violence thrown in for good measure.
It is right and proper that the Chinese Government do something to protect their citizens embarking on a foreign marriage.
Having said that, I dont know about the other countries, but in Aus, part of the Imigration procedure we must go through will be to produce evidence of assets, liabilities, income and job content. If we cant show that we are at least capable of maintaining some sort of life standard, then we wont get a visa for our wife/fiance.
In any event, any man who is serious and genuine would share financial details with his future partner...wouldn't he ??????? Then she can make her own judgement about what the future may hold...beyond the rose coloured glasses. !!!
But of course, most bros would do this.....again, it is the "bad apples" that attract all the official attention
Good guys have nothing to fear with this type of scrutiny by the Chinese Govt., in whatever form it takes...and they are right to care about the future welfare of Chinese Women who marry foreigners.
ps...Sorry Jason, I just read your post and you have already said the same things about Aus Visa process/Income proof.
-
I'm going to have to agree with Bee on this.What the hell is somebodies tax returns going to prove?Spousal abuse has never.Ben attributed to how much money the people make.All these fems are doing is trying to get.Noticed So the leader of this little group can be appointed to a higher job.So that she and her cohorts can.Get bigger kickbacks down the line.
Thiere is documented cases of Chinese woman marring a foreigner..And the marraige goes to hell.So the woman does get hurt or Killed.I'm willing to bet.That if you took 1,000 foreign marriages.Against a 1,000 Chinese marriages.That the abuse in a Chinese marraige is much higher.Then it would be when a foreigner married a Chinese woman.
If these fems are really worried about the health and welfare.Of the Chinese woman.Maybe they should rethink thiere priorities.And start by setting up abused women shelters in China.Or make it a crime in China.To beat the hell out of your wife or girlfriend.Give the battered woman some legal rights in China.And make the local police force enforce the laws.instead of taking a kick back from the accused
Do that then you can talk to me about better ways to improve the screening process.For the foreign husband or fiance.Paul I know this is just a article that you seen somewhere.So you posted it here.and it was a good idea to post it here.The members do need to know if something like this may be a requirement down the road..
What bothers me Is that even in China.Thiere are groups like this.That sacrifice the good of the many.For thiere own personell gain.They could give a shit less.about the health and welfare of any woman who married a foreigner.All they want is to see thiere fearless leaders name in the spotlight.SO they can reap the benefits latter.
-
Paul,
an interesting artice to say the least. should there be a concern on their part that a lady gets involved in a good marriage, SURE, but i think its a smoke screen for the purpose of furthuring their own agenda. China should look at the internal problems here in the country
with regard to the following:
DOMESTIC VIOLENCE-- there are no consequences for your actions unless you kill someone.
WORKPLACE------------- safety, hours, abuse by employers,not getting paid
WELFARE----------------- according to the stats here in China there is a staggering amount of poor people here and the numbers
are a staggering 800,000 by their own accounting. these people have nothing to rely on but to try and get
whatever they can to eat and live and yes some do work and just make enough to eat noodles or rice
each day. some resort to begging to get by.
marrying a westerner should be looked at but not put up as a number one priority to further your own agenda. lets start to do
something for the people here who are not leaving the country. i see it all the time and if you go to the countryside towns and
villages then it is even more prevelant. lately here in guangzhou i have been seeing many many old people resorting to digging in the trash and begging for money. these people probably worked harder than we would ever do and now have to do this to survive??
You know everyone gets amazed about how their lady argues over 1 or 2 rmb when buying fruits and vegetables or the haggling when buying larger items. well this is caused by the welfare situation that is in place here. if you dont save for the future then you have nothing. and on the flip side you have the vendor selling the items trying to do the same. make money for the future so they can live with some dignity in their later years.
this is what someone should come along and try to change because it is the root cause of the problems here and if you want to make it better then tackle these issues to make life better here for quite a large protion of the population. not come out and think that a major issue here is marriage to a westerner.
or with the imbalance here in men to women ratio and one that will get worse before it gets better is this just a way for them to try and discourage people from considering this route of marrying a westerner?? i dont know because you cant know what is in their mind but it would be interesting to be a fly on the wall when these people meet behind close doors to discuss their strategy.
-
I would like to state that I do not have a problem providing a financial statement or employment proof to show ability to support a wife.
Dave C
-
3 years ago or something there were alarming bells and whistles . For it had been discovered. We could actually contract cancer from eating gingerbread.
Evidence much later has proven that we can, if we eat a kilo per day.
These new discoveries adding fuel to all doomsday prophecies will never cease. Wether they are true or not
None that has felt the slightest worry about SCO however? And the real motives?
Just to add hehe.
-
This should really be called "haven't they got something to worry about!" But oh well, here goes..........
Why are American men more successful in relationships than American women? Are they????? I here you ask......Well here's a fun fact, American men who marry foreign women have a much lower divorce rate than American men who marry American women.
In fact the divorce rate between American men and American women is around 60%. There's a better chance of having a disastrous marriage with an American women than a successful one, by a long shot. At the same time marriages with American men and foreign women are overwhelmingly more likely to be successful. According to the senators who sponsored the International Marriage Broker Regulation Act designed to protect foreign women from stealthy male American predators, some 8,000 to 12,000 U.S. men marry foreign wives each year (2009). The divorce rate of such couples is up to three times lower than the national average. Which is good because way more American men marry foreign women compared to American women and foreign men. So we'll see more healthy marriages with American men in the future.
At the same time American women who marry foreign men have an even higher divorce rate around 75% than American women have with American men. So While American men seem to be able to have a long healthy relationship with a woman. American women can't seem to have any sort of long healthy relationship with anyone in the world. ???
Now that's frightening .
In my scant research for the above post I came across the:-
www.ihatewhitewomen.blogspot.com (http://www.ihatewhitewomen.blogspot.com)
I did not include any figures from there for obvious reasons...................and I quote:-
"1. There are ENORMOUS desire/demand for American men from foreign women.
2. There is NO desire or demand for American women from foreign men (shame on you, ladies!).
3. It is likely that foreign people perceive American men to be BETTER than American women.
To the feminist, the American woman is highly sought after while the American man is only wanted for his money. Or he is just a walking green card. This line of thinking is so played out and false that it's not even worth talking about anymore. Have fun living in your little world where all the men on this planet desire you, and us men are seen as nothing but a way to a better life. Whatever gets you through the day ladies. Of course most of the women I have met in Asia had no desire to leave their families and come take up your way of life. So yeah, you are wrong, but then most American women have no concept of family, marriage, or anything other than what the ladies on the View have to say about evil men and their foreign brides. There is no demand for American women outside of this country. Lot's of demand for American men though. I think all those drugs you have taken for your various STDs are starting to have an affect on the brains of the idiotic American women."
If your feeling bitter and twisted read what this guy has to say and you'll feel much better. I think ::)
-
This does not surprise me at all . To add , I think the American Woman has put that on themselves . They are so proud to become equalto the Male counterpart .. that is maybe why they are concidered too much " MALE " for the average American Male . That leaves them just good for one-nighter's ( sad to say ) but their still welcomed by many Men , but Marriage .. NO WAY ! They shot themselves in the Foot and blame it on the Men here . Just like a Women .. american that is .
-
Paul
Fascinating information !!
I think if you substitute "Australian, or European etc" for the "American" Man, you would have exactly the same set of circumstances.
A parallel situation exists in Aus, and I am sure it also exists virtually everywhere in the Western World.
As usual, reality has been hijacked and twisted by the vocal minority of rabid feminists who are now seen to represent the majority view !!
These idiots have fought tirelessly for so-called equal rights, which is another way of saying dominance !!
Sadly, and call me sexist if you wish, a female is not biologically or mentally equipped to do many of the mental and physical stuff that has been a male characteristic for many, many thousands of years. But feminists dont care about that and they have trapped most women into a new stereotype that is leading ever onwards to disaster for the average woman.
The article you mention has a critical and key point.......if the new "feminism" is right for Women in general, then why all over the world has the "emancipated" woman become the total loser in the partnership stakes, why are western women now considered a poor risk for a long term relationship ??
Answer is not difficult.......because they have been brainwashed into abandoning the very characteristics that nature intended them to use to be the perfect partner...and I dont mean "slave" here.
Men, in general, have not been subject to such grotesque character modification and we still consider ourselves as responsible for looking after our families...shelter, protection, food etc.
So the western world is crashing deep into a basic character mismatch between men and women.....so we men, want to look further afield for a partner who upholds the traditional values of man/ woman/family and such.
Sure, there are ass888les who are out for a good time and nothing else, but the quest for a foreign wife is so costly, difficult and frustrating that they mostly fall by the wayside.
You have only got to read abnout many experiences here where men are frustrated at every turn by the various government agencies to realise that many different forces are at work to prevent us men marrying our desired partner from outside the bastard system we are forced to live in !!!...just ask Jimmy and Rhonald about his...to name 2 cases that spring to mind.
Thank goodness that we have a bunch of guys here who are all going through the same meat grinder process. Imagine how it would be without such knowlege and support.........individually we would all be in far more stress because we would believe that this beaurocratic crap is directed at us personally !!!
Dont let the bastards grind you down !!!!
DavidE
-
I just checked out the % divorce rate in the UK and the office for national statistics says it's running around 50% with an expected rise this year of 2% due to the economy being not that great. So the UK is right up there with the US. I think the thing that surprised me most was that the divorce rate is up to three times lower with a foreign bride. Given all the stress and cultural differences we have all experienced not to mention the bureaucratic nightmare some have had to live through, we still have a much better chance of a lasting relationship with these lady's than one of our own! ;D
David, "Thank goodness that we have a bunch of guys here who are all going through the same meat grinder process. Imagine how it would be without such knowledge and support.........individually we would all be in far more stress because we would believe that this bureaucratic crap is directed at us personally !!!"
Absolutely spot on, well said! :)
-
I do agree with David E and Paul.This can and will be a living hell without some kind of support.When I went threw this.Thiere wasn't allot of information out thiere.This forum wasn't here.Chnlove's forum was a joke.With allot of miss information.So it was real tough.And I don't suggest anybody to do it the way I did.
Also for the reason stated by the other brothers.The western woman has worked them selves into a position.Where most men are not interested in dealing with.A western women's attitude.So they do go outside of thiere own country or customs.To look for a wife.
I think I have it figured out why the divorce rate is allot lower.With a mixed marraige.The main reason I think is because with a mixed marraige.You have more at stake then you do with a traditional marraige.You have all the time and effort to find the right woman for you.You have the custom and culture issues.The laungage issues.You are looking at 6 months to a year.or better to even get your new wife to your country.And lets not forget How bloody expensive this is.
So in my case.I try very hard not to treat this marraige.like I did my previous relationships and my first marraige.I actually do listen closely to what my wife is trying to tell me.Because she still has problems with English.I pay closer attention to her body laungage.I try to be sensitive.To the custom and culture differences.And I now have infinite patience.When she doesn't understand what I'm trying to tell her.And I try to remember if it hadn't ben for me.My wife wouldn't have to deal with the day to day issues of living in a foreign country.
I think if you have to work this hard to make something like this work.You take better care of it.Then you would.If somebody else just gave it to you.I don't care who you are.Or what god you pray to.You are going to be setting alone one night.While the wife and the kids are sleeping.And think to yourself.F**k this woman came half way around the world.Left her family and friends.And everything else she ever knew.Just to be with your raggedy ass.And the hope.That you will be a good person and a good Husband.You really have to respect a woman who would do all that just for you.
-
Right on Maxx....
To "flesh-out" this debate a bit, I would add that we have no choice but to spend a year or more, communicating with our Chinese Wife, on QQ or such, with email, phone and all, and every so often we get to spend a few precious weeks together in person, before we are able to take up life as a married couple. This is a very fundamental contrast with the sort of relationship we may have with a local woman.
During this time we have the ever present language issues, the difference in culture and tradition.
When you have got through these hurdles, you get to realise that you have both invested heaps and heaps in your future relationship, and if you were not serious, it never could have survived the journey !!!...and having survived and grown during the journey, is the stronger because of it.
I never considered myself much of a patient Man, but over the past year I have learned and learned and learned to be both patient and sensitive as I watch my lovely Lady bust her ass to learn a new language, prepare herself wholeheartedly to leave job, friends and family to come to live in a foreign land that is completely alien to her previous way of thinking and living.
At the same time, she is always supporting me and giving me heaps of encouragement and accolades for being the best LG (our Chinglish...she is LP and I am LG)
This woman will only have me in the future, to be the one who will be responsible for her transition to this new life...it is a sobering, humbling and at the same time delightful responsibility.
I never before put anything like the effort into a relationship as I am doing with this one...and it feels good. I cannot honestly say I could be bothered to do the same for the average woman I might meet locally...it would not be appreciated, understood or valued !!!
So do I cherish this relationship above all else....you bet!!!, and that is why in some way it is safer and more real than any other...and I know it will last. We will go through a very hot fire...to be together, but we will make it work...because we want to do it...together.
Those Bros who went before have prepared the way for the rest of us with knowlege and support. Those of you starting out on this journey...know you are not alone and there is always someone here to help...with both real practical advice when needed...and sometimes with advice you dont want to hear.
Either way, it makes it all a bit more doable ;D ;D ;D
David
-
These are all valid points. And what about us guys who give up everything to move to China? Should
we expect them to do the same for us? Or just have us turn Chinese and forget were we had come from.
I would like to hear some comments on this topic. This might be interesting.
-
Ted you and the other brothers who live in China.Have Chosen a different path.As far as your wives are concerned.You still have the same job the rest of us do.You just have to figure out how to do the job in a different country.Which I'm sure can be kind of tough in another country.Especially if you do not speak.The laungage well.And you also have to figure out how everything works.Different country different customs.
We can break it down.Love honor,Trust.These should all be real easy to do anywhere in the world.And everybody hear knows what the words mean.So I won't explain them.
Lets just skip over that part.And get to the heart of the matter.Why do you think your wife agreed to marry you? I don't think it was for a green card.I don't think it was because you are the most handsome man she has ever seen.I don't think it was for instant wealth and popularity.With her friends,Family and the neighbors.
I do think it was for love.and support financially and emotionally.She has had a bad day at the office.She knows your at home waiting for her.She is supposed to be able to talk to her best friend.And tell him what is on her mind.And her best friend is not supposed to pass judgment.Her best friend is supposed to be thiere.To comfort her console her.And help her battle all the evil things in her life.
The financial support.She is going to come up a little short on money this month.And all your wife can see is the daily grind.Not being able to pay the bills.No money for food.And no chance to rise above the humdrum.Of everyday life.This is where you come into the picture.You both should have the same bank account.You should be adding money to the bank account.And planning.Your next great adventure together.Giving your wife something to look forward to.Thiere should be no secretes between you and your best friend.If thiere are secretes.Or if one partner has a hidden agenda.Then thiere is going to be problems.At sometime during the relationship
And with a Chinese woman the special things don't have to be big or expensive .With my wife.It is Chinese food every Saturday.That she doesn't have to cook.Walks along the river.Going driving threw the mountains.At least one trip a year to China.If my wife wants to buy.Clothes or something special for herself or the kids.My reply is ok.Do you want to do it now.Or do you want to go latter.
Ted it all boils down to just supporting.Your wife.Just like they supports us.I do the daily grind in the states.Does it piss me off my wife doesn't work.No not in the least bit. she is home every time I came home.She has her own special smile reserved for me.And I get to see it everyday.She tries to force feed me food as soon as I step threw the door.She drops whatever she is doing.And tries to make me comfortable.It is me and my wife.Against the world.And we reassure each other of that everyday.
Ted the age of the lady your married to.Says she is probably traditional.Which means.You are the hunter.And the protector of the family cave.My wife is the same way.I make the money for the family.I do all the repairs to the cave.I protect the cave.She keeps the cave clean.She takes care of the kids 90% of the time.And makes sure that I'm not anoid.Or uncomfortable.When I come home from work.
If you are trying to break your wifes traditions.It is going to cause you nothing but grief.Ted as long as you and your wife have ben married.99% of the time.your wife doesn't even remember that she is married to a foreigner.How do I know this? Because I forget all the time.That I'm married to a Chinese woman.Yes I know she eats food.I wouldn't even think about eating.She does some strange things.That most Americans don't do.And she has got this strange accent when she speaks English.
What I do know is my wife is my best friend.I know she looks to me to provide a safe and comfortable place to live.And she looks to me to provide the money so that her and the kids can eat.Be warm and comfortable.And she relies on me to be her best friend.And stand with her.No matter what it is.Weather it is here or in China.
-
These are all valid points. And what about us guys who give up everything to move to China? Should
we expect them to do the same for us? Or just have us turn Chinese and forget were we had come from.
I would like to hear some comments on this topic. This might be interesting.
I would say that Maxx is 100% right...When the shoe is on the other foot (the women going to your country) is giving up most of their customs/traditions, then surely, WE can do the same. We don't have to turn Chinese, in our hearts we KNOW were we came from, be it USA/Canada/UK/Australia..whereever. I just know that I have travelled half way around the world to meet this lady, and I want to stay here.
Will I turn Chinese if I stay,?... NO CHANCE, I'm Scots and always will be, it is JUST MY outlook that will change NOT my heart. But you do have a valid point Ted!!!
-
Good point Ted !!!
But Man is supposed to be the "provider"...especially in Chinese society. So when you made the decision to move to China to be with your wife, you did not lose the requirement to be the Head of your family...only you will do it in her country, not yours.
I am sure that your wife is very much aware of the importance of your decision, and you have spared her a serious lot of trouble and angst that she would have got had she moved to America.
But in the final crunch, you decided to go down your own track...together....and that is the best definition of a good relationship....it matters little where the physical geography is, as long as you both are comfortable with it.
Having said that, I agree with Rob...living in China compells you to change your lifestyle and to some extent your behaviour...but it can never change who you are and what you have come from.
I have been in Aus many, many years...my kids are 100% Aussie...but I will always retain my own English heritage, however much I love this country ...I think the same for you (and all the others who have done the same)....as they say "you can take the man out of the country, but you cant take the country out of the man" ;D ;D ;D
David
-
Wow what a good read. It made me think a lot. And I have realized that 100% of the opposition I was getting for having a Chinese Wife was coming from American women.
And everyone of these women are lonely and unhappy gold diggers. They were able to plant a lot of doubt in me that has never gone away. I have always just tried to over look it, and sometimes it is really hard. But after reading this I think now I better understand why they tell me these things. I guess I knew it all along but somethings have been said here that have helped finally put it all together. So Thank You My Friends.
And I would mention that we really can't stereotype the guys living in China either. Every one of us are here for a different reason in common. In Common we are all here to be with our wives, that is obvious. Some are here to teach it is really what they want to do. Others are teaching because they don't want to wipe out the capital they started with, so the earn so they can leave that original pile of cash alone.
And then their are the guys like me, I have no intention of staying here forever. I am here to be with my wife. To help her learn some English and just be with her through her Interview and to escort her home when it is time to go. Her English has gotten much better but still not good. To show it is a marriage based on Love. We don't have 1000 pictures, and we have not done all the traveling together that most of the guys have done. We save receipts but not religiously.
January 13 I arrived in China. The next morning I married my wife. A few days later we rented an Apartment together. And all but 12 weeks this year we have lived in it together. And all the Stamps in my passport will prove it. I have not spent 1 single night in China that my wife was not with me.
In my head that should be plenty of proof in itself.
As most of you know I have a heart problem, I had to spend 7 days in a Chinese hospital. and other than to go to use the bathroom my wife was at my side every minute. She fed me washed me did anything I need. Man if that isn't Love I don't know what is. Just this very minute she walked passed me, saw a small spot on my shirt. Pulled it off of me, telling me that shirt is dirty I must wash it now. An American woman no way would she do these things I see it as love. The American woman see's it as stooping to a lower level.
These American women have no idea what equal rights are, Because what they really want is extra rights. They don't want to work and be equal to the man. They want men to take 2 steps back and give it to them. The US Government I won't even get started on that. Bashing the USA is not allowed here. But if it were, I would be willing to bet most of the guys doing it would be Americans.
Anyway I kind of got off track here. Anyway thanks for the good Info I am happy to say this is a thread that has truly been helpful for me.
-
China can be a frustrating place to live,if I said it didn't put a strain on Ming zhi and my relationship at times I would be lieing. It's how you deal with the problems that arise that makes all the difference,but that's true anywhere in the world.
When I moved over here a little over a year ago now I didn't think I was giving anything up. In fact quite the opposite, I thought I was gaining a hell of a lot. We both knew at the beginning that we came from different cultures, just how deep that went took me a while to find out! :) I don't want or need to become more Chinese and she doesn't need to become more western,we love and laugh about the differences all the time but bottom line is, we are man and wife and that's the same everywhere. Same rights and the same responsibilities. In some ways I feel less stressed because my wife is surrounded by her family and friends and it's me that has to deal with the differences rather than the other way round. For better or worst,richer or poorer I think the words go. It doesn't matter where you are as long as your committed and faithful to each other.
We share everything together nothing is mine or hers, it's ours. We discuss any problems we have with life in general or with each other and share our hopes and dreams. If one of us has a bad day we know the other is waiting and can be relied on to listen and as Maxx pointed out not to judge but to support. When she is at work she tells me she's thinking about me and can't wait to get home and when I finish at school there she is waiting to drive me home. There are no secrets or hidden agenda's between us and we enjoy each others friendship and company. We most certainly don't take each other for granted and even after a year I still can't believe she is my wife!
If your marriage has a sound base then it would take a lot to break that bond with a Chinese woman. They are fiercely loyal and one thing I can say without doubt is that my wife wants our marriage to be a success and will do everything in her power to make that happen and I am the same. What a refreshing difference from my first time around! Is it perfect? defiantly not, but it's not that far away from it either!
Whatever we earn in a month goes into the same pot and she deals with all the expenses, what ever is left she diligently squirrels away in our joint bank account. As for living here or the UK or where ever that is a decision we will take together if and when we decide to make it something we have decided needs action. There's a lot of China I want to see and a lot of Europe and the US she would like to see too, they are not mutually exclusive and we are in no hurry.
To see it in terms of what you are losing or giving up instead of what you gain is a huge mistake in my opinion, but then again I've always been the glass is half full sort of guy. I honestly believe that this whole adventure has made me a better person as has my wife,not by laying down rules which as a point of principal I tend to rebel against anyway but just by ......well I'm not quite sure, but all you guy's with Chinese wives know what I'm trying rather badly to say! ;)
-
Paul,
That is well said.That is exactly how it should be in these relationships and should not be met
halfway. When i said turn chinese what i meant was control issues that some people have. And
you shouldnt let yourself fall into that with a lady from here.
It should be of mutual agreement not based on some saying or tradition. Sounds like you and Ming
have a good handle on this and that was what i was trying to convey here.
China is not the easiest country to live in and the money you bring here should stay in the bank for a
rainy day and you should live on what you make and plan from that. There is always a better road ahead
and that road should be waited upon for the two of you. Not used all up now and left with nothing.
Its interesting you have a joint account because i know of some who got a cold reception on that and then
told others a different version of what is happening. If your not going to have a joint account to work together
with then what do you have? seperate accounts.
That doesnt make it bad but i really think it should be like you guys have it. Its a good formula for success.
Anyway just wanted to see what others thought on this because if you were living in your country then everything
would be joint no this is mine this is yours thats how i always did it.