China Romance
General Discussion and Useful Links => Newbies Corner => Topic started by: Lee357 on January 29, 2010, 01:46:34 am
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Patients I keep telling myself that. My lady keeps talking about marriage and associating it with my upcoming visit. I keep telling her that I am just coming to visit her and get her fathers aproval of me, this vist. To elaborate I can speak fairly good Mandarin and so I have had phone conversations with both her mother and her father. I even spent 2 hours speaking to her uncle once. I know that this has shown her that I am serious and that I want to marry her but I am not ready to commit to it before I meet her in person. I have even web camed with her and her mother and father at the same time for about 3 hours last night and tried to explain the above position. She just called me and once again she is talking of us getting married when I visit. I know she wants to get married, and I know she is scared that I will come visit her and then go home and change my mind. So enough of background on my situation, now on to why I post. I would like your opinions on if I have created my own problems with her expectations? Can you suggest a different approch to take in getting her to understand I am not coming in July to marry her? Ok I just reread this and to answer you question yes I have told her and her parents that I am not ready to commit to marriage befor I meet her in person. I just don't want her to be disapointed when I come and don't marry her on the second day I am there. I will be taking my paper work so If we do hit it off I am ready to but I am still not going with that as a plan
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Maybe the words used? I found the word "Suitable" for marriage works. My lady and I when we started talking of the M word, she said in one letter that seemed to me meant she wasn't sure we would marry? My heart dropped when I read it at first. But later found what she meant. We are in agreement now.
Let me explain. She and I are committed to each other but we're holding an escape route open incase. We have the agreement of talk of marriage and other future thoughts but when we actually meet is when we make our (each of us) decision to marry. Her words were when we meet we will see how "Suitable" we are. Both being careful not just to marry for the sake of. I was surprised and happy at the same time for this was a load off my mind. I knew the face to face meet will tell all but when she had the same thought? It showed we were on the same path. Actually it brought us closer for it took allot of tension off.
The outcome is, when we do meet then we will choose to marry then or another time? or not at all. So now it is a joke between us. Maybe we will marry after we surface a few days later?
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hope it all works out for you Lee
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My first trip to China was last summer, and I had no intention to marry, and I did not have the paperwork for it either .... which was good because the first thing the agency owner told me after I met her and my lady at the airport is that she was NOT ready, or prepared to get married during my visit. I knew that we needed to spend time to see if we were really good for each other.
By the end of my trip, I knew this was the one for me, and I know she made a decision as well. So my next trip will be for getting married.
you might need a few days, or a whole new trip to figure this out, but your lady needs to understand this and respect your position, and to allow you to make your decision.... I do not think this is something people should rush into until they are ready.
Mike O.
Mike do you think I should even be taking the paper work? Is that going to cause more trouble than it is worth for me? I never intended on telling her I had the documentation on me or that I was planning on having the documentation. I am sorry if I am asking dumb questions but this is my first visit to see a Lady and I want it to go as smoothly as possible for me mostly but for her as well. Call it self preservation.
I thank all of you for your advice.
I am truly hoping she is the same or at least very similar in person Scott, I know in person she will be different than in letters, EMF, phone, but I hope not too much different. I also hope she can deal with me snoring loudly at night. I have told her but you know in her ear it might make a difference. :icon_biggrin:
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If it were me, I would take the paperwork, but not tell her. It could very well turn out that this is the lady you want to marry, and only you will know if it is. But, if you have the patience, wait. Be aware though, that she will likely want to go through your bags looking for clothes to clean or put away. She might not take too kindly to you keeping secrets from her.
If I had been ready with my paperwork, I would have gotten married on my second trip (Christmas).
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Lee, Probably the best way if your not sure is to leave the paperwork at home or the hotel safe in China. Don't let her know you have it, or just tell the truth and tell her it's at home.
By the way, love the picture, and the white horse. Mines black. Is that your buddy? Whats his name?
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I am with Neil on this. Take it with you because you just never know.
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If it were me, I would take the paperwork, but not tell her. It could very well turn out that this is the lady you want to marry, and only you will know if it is. But, if you have the patience, wait. Be aware though, that she will likely want to go through your bags looking for clothes to clean or put away. She might not take too kindly to you keeping secrets from her.
If I had been ready with my paperwork, I would have gotten married on my second trip (Christmas).
Very good advise about her most likely wanting to go through my bags. I would have never thought about that. Thank you for that gem. She speaks very little English but I truly have no Idea how much she can read. My big problem here is I don't want to be the one that screws this up by doing something stupid. I should say more stupid than I am usually. Ahhh!!! all this for a Lady I haven't even met yet.:s
I thank all of you for your help I have decided to take the papers just like I planed and see what happens. If she happens to see them I will just come clean and tell her why they are there. I am going to stay in China for the full 90 days my Visa is good for if she is the one so I really need to be prepared. Yes I do believe I have made my mind up on this issue. thanks to all that replied to this thread. Any other advise is still apreciated. I am so nervous at this point I am not sure that by the time I leave for china I will remember my own name.
The horses name is Shalala and she is a pure blooded Egyption Arabian. She is my best and by the sounds of your other posts she is a lot like your horse, only works when she wants to. Good thing I have 4 wheelers to gather the cows off the winter range or I might as well be walking some days if I had to rely on her.
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I took the completed papers twice on two visits - but never used either sets. Obviously the ladies in question were not looking for a suave and debonaire character!!:icon_cool: Or perhaps they were and that was why they rejected me!!!! But my experience in collecting the papers together was good for the UK members of the brotherhood (Hmm! I wonder if they would club together and helpout with the costs involved - no I couldn't ask - but I know a man who can -HEY ROB you anywhere around!:icon_cheesygrin:)
Lee your right about meeting face to face before making any decisons. I spent many weeks on phone calls every day before finally coming here and realising that the person I had been talking to was not the same one I imagined her to be. But take the paperwork with you already - if you do click that shows willing and you will have six months to use the papers in if you are from the UK - not sure if from elsewhere.
Willy
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Take the papers with you.You never know what could happen
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Hi Lee,
A belated welcome to the Forum; this is where it is all at, as I'm sure you are discovering!
I would definitely take the paperwork with you but not tell her that you have it. I don't regard this as dishonest, although perhaps a little disingenuous. However, if you do tell her you have it and then decide you need more time to think about marriage, and do not marry her during this trip, you will put some serious doubts (and perhaps wrongful thoughts) in her mind about why you didn't marry her: "He brought the paperwork, he must have been thinking about marrying me, so why didn't he?" Thoughts of this nature would also be very hurtful to her - and I sense from your posts, particularly with regard to Plan B (which I also empaphise with!) that you have a thoughtful and caring personality.
However, I am sure you know there are always those times in life when you look back and say: "If only I had........" And by the time you make your next trip, those doubtful and wrongful thoughts may have accumulated her hurt, and she may be gone. Others may say that if she loved you and was truly committed, she would wait. But are you prepared to take that chance? Life is largely about fate and opportunities; it's those we miss that we tend to dwell on the most. It has also been my experience throughout life that you can rarely fully fathom what is in a woman's thoughts and heart, and in that respect you have to be ready to take your opportunities and shape your own fate. Taking the paperwork with you allows you to do that, and removes doubt and hurt from the equation of thought.
I hope you have a really happy time with your lady in China - and I'm sure you will make the right decision!
Johnboy
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Johnboy,
Thank you for your well thought out reply. The "Lost Love" syndrom is why I got the papers ready when I decided this Lady was worth going to see. I wanted to be ready to marry her on the spot if I get there and she is indeed who she seems to be from thousands of miles away. I am going to take the paperwork with me. I just hope I can keep the secret, I am a terrible at lying. I am worried because she already seems to be able to tell when I am thinking about something I am not comfortable with. She also has been very efficient at getting what ever information she wants out of me without me even knowing I have given it to her.
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I am with Neil on this. Take it with you because you just never know.
I agree. Keep it tuck away in the hotel safe.
Lee ... you have to meet in person to see if there's any physical chemistry as well. Your approach is good.
A westerner that can speak Mandarin ... you're a catch right off the bat.
Sleep on your ‘side' to decrease snoring. Keep a pillow by your backside to prevent rolling over.
All the best on your trip.
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Hey Lee,
Welcome to the hood. Myself and Chong are the resident asians here. And I agree with what you said, take the paper but do not tell her.
For me, the first visit is about getting to know the person and then later visits engagement and marriage. Rushing things is always a bad idea, hence my first marriage.
Singer
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Update,
I read an article post in one of these forums and used the information there to help me get her to understand why the first visit is just to meet each other. The article was for teachers in china and it said that in chinese dating the first meeting is usually in a group just so the two parties can accertain the fitness of the other person for marriage ( sound so very business like). The second "date" is based on the outcome of the first "date". It is used to show that interest in marriage has been descided. The third date is to confirm that marriage is thought to be coming soon. Next is meeting the parents and apperantly this is the same as in the western world a declaration of engagement. So during tonights (my time) phone call I explained to Lin Ya that I did not understand (cultural difference) what me already talking to her parents and meeting them on web cam ment to her (with above information). I then reiterated that I was coming to meet her first and if we were "two hearts beating as one" we would get married if not we would need more time to discuss if we are going to be that. She then understood exactly what my intentions were and was happy again about the progress of our relationship. She told me that to her our letters, phone conversations, web cams and the phone conversations with her parents and her uncle were those "dates" (or milestones if you like). A not so simple cultural misunderstanding. HAHA if there such a thing as a simple cultural misunderstanding when so much time and energy is put into building a relationship to last a "lifetime" from thousands of mile away. I am glad that she and I can communicate with the same language. I truly have respect for those brothers that are able to do this without a shared language and a different cultural set of norms.
A westerner that can speak Mandarin ... you're a catch right off the bat.
Thank you Chong for the advise.
I studied Mandarin in college for 2 years and have been a tourist in China about six times for a total of about a year and a half worth of time total. This is the only time I have tried or even thought of marriage though and I am finding it to be a totally different set of cultural issues that I have never before encountered. This is the first Lady I had contacted on CL and I went through just like most I think the time of "is she real" Is this or that written by the translator. I just totally ignored my fear and continued to write her daily. I think we went to almost 20 EMF's before the first web cam sesion. I do unerstand why she resisted. Loosing face in front of someone she wants to marry is a huge fear. I was patient and understanding though and I hope it will pay off. I am certainly not going to fall into the trap of believing all is roses and perfume when I go. I am a country boy and I know that a rose still smells like a rose even when it has cow sh*t on it.
I really want to thank all of you who have offered such advice to me. I can truly see why the old addage of we either stick together or we will surely hang seperatly is true in this situation.
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Hey Lee,
Welcome to the hood. Myself and Chong are the resident asians here. And I agree with what you said, take the paper but do not tell her.
For me, the first visit is about getting to know the person and then later visits engagement and marriage. Rushing things is always a bad idea, hence my first marriage.
Singer
What am I? And I have a feeling Odysseus is as well...
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What am I? And I have a feeling Odysseus is as well...
Don't forget me :huh: I am Cauc asian too.
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Ni hao, looks like shalala is a beautiful horse. She likes to run as you can tell by that tail. How many hands is she?
Are you planning on living in China or the US. ???
I suggest hideing the papers, until you know for sure. Stick em in the hotel safe for now, along with your passport. Also, you can do what scottish rob does and that's let the lady's pick you up. If it works for a scottsman it's gotta work for you to....ha :icon_cheesygrin:
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be prepared and bring with you
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Ni hao, looks like shalala is a beautiful horse. She likes to run as you can tell by that tail. How many hands is she?
Are you planning on living in China or the US. ???
I suggest hideing the papers, until you know for sure. Stick em in the hotel safe for now, along with your passport.
Ni hao rockycoon zaoshang hao,
She is 15 hands and yes she does love to run. I think I will take advise from every body and take the papers, but I won't be staying in a hotel. I will be staying with friends while I am there. Instead I think I will give them to my friend to hold on to. My lady wants to meet me at the airport but since I will be flying into Hong Kong then taking the ferry over and my friends will meet me there so she wont be able to. I will be meeting her the next morning. My Lady told me that her parents will be with us on the first day and will be staying with her for the first 3 days of my visit. I don't mind telling you that I am not happy about that but it is the way it is. Stubborn Lady she is. I think finally she is starting to acert herself a little bit. Sign she is comfortable with the relationship? Who knows what the hell these Ladies are thinking.
I am going to live in China if we get married for the first year maybe year and a half, but then we will move back. That being said if we hit it off and end up getting married and that is a big if at this point. I will still have to come back and change my visa status and set things in order here in the states before I will be able to go and stay In China.
I have a question for you all, Has anybody ever looked into bringing a Lady over to your country to meet her? I know it is a big hassle to get a visa to the states but how about other countries? I think I already know the answer to this but others opinion would be interesting. I think going over there is better regardless of visa because if it doesn't work out you can always meet another Lady while you are there. So, what I am really asking is more about visa restrictions in other countries.
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I have a question for you all, Has anybody ever looked into bringing a Lady over to your country to meet her? I know it is a big hassle to get a visa to the states but how about other countries? I think I already know the answer to this but others opinion would be interesting. I think going over there is better regardless of visa because if it doesn't work out you can always meet another Lady while you are there. So, what I am really asking is more about visa restrictions in other countries.
Not even worth the hassle of trying to get a Tourist Visa to Australia for a single Chinese lady...they would never allow it. This has been tried many, many times but for us...an impossible task !!!!
If I meet a lady and decide to marry her, then I can make the usual application for her to come here on a fiance visa.....much the same as USA and Europe.
Once the application for a Fiance visa has been completed and submitted...then they will grant a 3 month Tourist visa for her to come and see the place. But she must NOT be in Australia when her Fiance Visa is issued...she must return home to pick it up !!!!.....drives you to tears doesn't it !!!!
DavidE
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i do beleive it is almost if not impossible also for the states for
your lady to get a visa for tourist. unless she was part of a tour
from China with a large group.
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why return home to pick it up? doesnt make sense?
i dont think you can get that for the usa unless she
is part of a tour group
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For Canada she has to be part of a tour group. She could not get a tourist visa otherwise. I don't know about student visas. Here in Canada there is also paperwork you have to sign for you to get a visa for your wife that if she ends up leaving you (bolts) and ends up on the social welfare system within the first three years any money the government pays out comes right off your check. Thats just for the first three years. As a further note, for citizenship in Canada she has to be in the country for 1000 days, about three years (maybe it was about 1200 I don't remember exactly). Any time back home or for vacations out of the country has to be made up afterward. IE you have a visit back home to see the parents in China for 60 days this 60 days gets tacked on to the 1000, it then becomes 1060 days. Several coleagues of mine had foreign wives and were a wealth of information on things that I didn't know. Whatever the situation, don't be afraid to ask. If you have to, write it down so you don't forget to ask. I have to do this. I was always interrogating the guys I worked with about their situation. I'm sure that they may have even thought I was getting too personal at times too, I may have done this unintentionally. Best of luck to you Lee.
Dave C
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to find out in this jumbled mess of imigration you just need to keep asking
people who have experienced it first hand Bee . not sure of the canadian process
but the usa process seems like a lot of double talk when you read it. hell i might
just end up staying in china happy as i am than go thru all the mess to go home
for a few years
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update to all my brothers and sisters on here,
I can wait no longer so I have confirmed my visa as a 12 month multi entry and have bought more plane tickets and am leaving tonight to see my Lady. I will not be posting while there sorry but I will update upon my return. I will be there for 13 days this time and still will be returning there in july for a longer visit 60 days as approved by the consulate in San Fransisco due to my repeated visits to their great country. :icon_cheesygrin: wish me luck as this will be the first time I have visited my Lady in person. wow what a whilwind of emotions.
I remember the advise "expect nothing, and the forever valuable 24 hr rule" Thanks guys for helping me out to this point. You may never know how much it has meant to me.
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Best of luck Lee...MOST IMPORTANT....ENJOY YOURSELF:icon_biggrin::icon_biggrin:
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what part is lee going to? shenzhen area? didnt see that in the posts
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Update! This is Lee's roomate Kevin. He just called and asked me to get on here and give an update. He is having a great time and has found the one. Will be getting married on his next trip. He is in qounqing? not to sure of the spelling I know it is a northern city quite large. He called it a first level city what ever that means. He will be able to fill in more when he returns after the new year there. He is spending the holiday with his Lady and her family. I think that is all he wanted me to let you know. If not he will fill you in later.
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Hi Kevin,
Thanks for the update. I believe the city Lee is mentioning is Chongqing.
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thank you kevin...
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Ok have this phone fiqured out now. This is lee sorry to have to have my roomate post for me but I have been a little busy. So this is the one and we are very much in love. Lucky me I got one on the first try. I will be leaving for home in 5 days. To soon I will say that. When I get back I will post pictures the internet here is very troublesome. I got this phone but since it is with att it is very expensive to use here. The 24 hour rule has been a life saver thank who wver thought it up. Gotto go dad is taking me to meet his friends from down the street.
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Lee -- congrats on everything working out and we all cant
wait to see your pictures of your stay
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Hey Lee, good to hear. Hopefully you can fill us in on the details of why you had to use the 24 hour rule.
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Yeah what mustfocus said.Now I'm curios to.And your welcome.
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Good on ya mate!
Grats to you both!
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Ok I missed it...what's the 24 hour rule?
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/facepalm
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Maxx, it is your rule. You tell him.
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Maxx...Mods
Can you please put the 24 hour rule onto somewhere that you must read to agree to coming into this site?...Or put it onto IMPORTANT INFOR MATION. :icon_biggrin:
twrme this is not aimed at you ok brother...
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From the head of Maxx -
Maxx's 24 HOUR RULE LIVE IT LOVE IT LEARN IT 24 hour rule says. No matter what crazy thing your women says to you. In a letter webcam chat or on the phone. You are not to comment on it for 24 hours.
24 hours gives you a chance to slow down to think about what the lady said. It also gives you a chance to post the question or situation here. Where the other members can discuss it amongest them selves. After 24 hours you will have a much better idea how to reply to the lady.
24 hour rule works good as long as the members remember to use it. 9 out of 10 times it is just a missed communication between the lady and the man Or a difference in custom and culture.
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Ok, just got home and what a visit it was. First time I have been in China for the lunar new years. What a hoot it was. I got an education on the traditional stories about why they do the things they do on each day. I was going to stay for 13 days but my lady had to return to work today or yesterday depending on which time zone I am in. I have a little jet lag going on right now. I will definitely be getting married on my next visit. I got her parents blessing this visit and accomplished the traditional matchmaker ceremony. That was a big pain in my arse I can tell you. I had no idea I was going to have to get a third party to introduce us then write a proposal on a piece of paper for this “matchmaker” to present to the parents and to my lady. Very formal thing, but what a party after it was all done. The Chinese really know how to throw a party. I have no idea what was in the drinks her dad kept giving me but I will tell you I was so drunk I actually started to see 3 of everything. My Lady was a trooper and stayed by my side the whole time and shielded me from most of the prying questions from dads’ friends once they got me drunk. She got offended a couple of times due to a few things I said while drunk and really ripped into me about it the next day. This is when the 24 hour rule came in handy (once again thank you Maxx). I did not respond to her onslaught until the next day and it turned out that while drunk my mandarin is not as accurate as it is when I am sober. The things that she was so upset over were more of a bad speaking issue than an intention thing. Dad thought it was funnier than shit. I was not prepared for how everything is played out right in front of the parents. After the whole argument was over dad took me out for Tea and explained to me how to avoid such issues in the future. I was amassed how much the solution was so much alike the way my dad always told me how to deal with women. My new Chinese dad told me that if she thinks I am wrong ; she is always right, just say I am sorry and that I love her enough to not do it again, if she is wrong then she is still right and I should say that I am sorry and I love her enough to never do it again. Sound familiar to advice any of us have ever gotten before. So now for my impression of my Lady and her profile pictures, emails, emf mail, etc. I think that she is the same person in all but the first 3 emfs. They were written by the translator for sure. She still tells me that she told the translator the idea of what she wanted but she did not know exactly what was written in the first 3 emfs. After that she actually wrote the rest, and after comparing what I received and the actual letters she wrote there is not much difference in them, a few words here and there, but in general the same letters. Now for the pictures; they were of her but heavily doctored. First thing is that they really lightened her skin tone. Apparently lighter skin is considered more appealing in China. I knew all of this before I went from our web cam sessions but in person it is still a little different than even on web cam. Other than that she is exactly what I expected. The relationship has defiantly changed now that she is sure that we will be getting married. She is in charge now there is now doubt about that. I am allowed the allusion that I still am in charge of our relationship and of how things from now on will go, but I know that I am not. I suggested a few things about the upcoming wedding and was promptly put in my place by my love and our mom. Dad told me to start just doing a lot of smiling and nodding my head. He told me to learn to be supportive and keep my mouth shut because they are only asking my opinion to allow me to save face in front of others not because they really want my opinion. What a riot this whole thing is. Dad is going to pay for half of this whole thing so that is a good thing. My Lady lives in Zhuhai and we will be getting married in Chongqing. So mother is going to be getting things prepared with input from my lady and none from me apparently. I am having so much fun with this. Dad and I have become very close so far, I really like him we have more in common than I would have thought considering the difference in culture. I think that is enough for now if you all have questions I will answer them if I can as I said I no longer am privy to most things concerning the wedding. I will post a picture of my lady in the next couple of days as she has only approved one for public display. I am so whipped it is pathetic. :blush:
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Sounds like your dad is really cool..:icon_cool: that's the kind of dad I would want.
And yes your WHIPPED. Guess we know who will wear the pants in that family, looks like you'll both
be shopping in the "mens" section at wall mart....hahaha:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
Idea, buy an apron at wall mart, so you won't get any water on
you when your washing the dishes....haha
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Idea, buy an apron at wall mart, so you won't get any water on
you when your washing the dishes....haha
What I like about Chinese women - WHAT I REALLY LIKE - is that when they take charge they TAKE CHARGE and that means the men stay out of the kitchen.
I have never been so pampered ever and still get my orange and apple and even my grapes peeled for me. But when it comes to running the home then I am definately in my place out of the kitchen.
Willy
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And yes your WHIPPED. Guess we know who will wear the pants in that family, looks like you'll both
be shopping in the "mens" section at wall mart....hahaha:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
Idea, buy an apron at wall mart, so you won't get any water on
you when your washing the dishes....haha
Hey now I was not allowed in the kitchen, something about not my place or something like that.
Idea, buy an apron at wall mart, so you won't get any water on
you when your washing the dishes....haha
What I like about Chinese women - WHAT I REALLY LIKE - is that when they take charge they TAKE CHARGE and that means the men stay out of the kitchen.
I have never been so pampered ever and still get my orange and apple and even my grapes peeled for me. But when it comes to running the home then I am definately in my place out of the kitchen.
Willy
I am glad my pain can give joy to someone. :icon_cheesygrin:
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we have brothers in the US that can hide you if needed...:icon_cheesygrin:
Keep an eye on that horse around thanksgiving....:dodgy:
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ok here is the pic of my Lady
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Glad your trip was a - I got smashed, or is that, smashing success :icon_cheesygrin: And thanks for sharing her picture with us here. I also like your quote about the apple. But I think the bird will be happy with any kind of apple once it is turned into apple cider.
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Nice picture, very beautiful lady, however I still say "you" are going to be washing dishes when she
gets westernized...:icon_cheesygrin:
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Nice picture, very beautiful lady, however I still say "you" are going to be washing dishes when she
gets westernized...:icon_cheesygrin:
Did I forget to tell you all that when I go over in october I am going to stay there. I can't believe I am going to but I am all the same. I have signed up for a tesl course in Zhuhai and after I am going to teach in china. I am an EMT/firefighter by trade but I do have a masters degree in agriculture and a bachelors in physics with a minor in astrophysics. I love my job but I do love this woman so much more. So no westernizing for her. lol :exclamation:
This is by far the craziest thing I have ever done but I am sure it will work out as I have extensive traveling experience in China and I know alot about living conditions in china. So I think I have a good idea of what I am getting into. I descided to move there for at least 2 years on about the fourth day on this visit. I always have loved China. so why not. :s
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So I found out today that changing my Visa from a L to a work visa is not going to be as easy as I first thought. Since I will be "going" to china in october for the tesl class and it last for 32 days I cant change my visa type yet. So I have a question for those of you that are currently teaching in china. How easy is it to get your visa type changed once you get a job teaching, and can you still just hop over to Hong Kong to pick up the new visa, or will I have to come all the way back to the states to get it? If this is covered in another post please just direct me to it and I will do the research myself.
Oh I forgot to mention that I will be going to get married in july and then returning to start the immigration paper work and put my "things in order" in the states then returning again in October to begin my new life with Linya.
Why does it seem to me that I have no time to do all these things, yet I have months to get them done? (not intended to be answered) :icon_confused:
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You will be OK in Zhuhai. Living conditions there are probably the best in all of China. Completely new city - non of the old former fishing village remains.
Maybe I will come across from Zhongshan and meet up - it is only 20 rmb by bus.
Willy
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Lee,
one of the biggest misconseptions is that you can get a work visa in hong kong. right now that is nearly
impossible for someone from the USA. Schools will tell you they can get you a work visa but you must check
to see if they have the papers that enables them to hire and employ western people. this certificate is issued
to them by the govt and if they have that then they can get you one but it will involve a trip back home. so
dont let anyone tell you different and from my sources in the govt here in GZ this will probably change after
the asian games this year. but you cant have a guarantee on that. the govt here moves as fast as a herd of
turtles stampeding thru peanut butter.:icon_cheesygrin:
-
You will be OK in Zhuhai. Living conditions there are probably the best in all of China. Completely new city - non of the old former fishing village remains.
Maybe I will come across from Zhongshan and meet up - it is only 20 rmb by bus.
Willy
It would be an adventure I am sure to meet you.
Lee,
one of the biggest misconseptions is that you can get a work visa in hong kong. right now that is nearly
impossible for someone from the USA. Schools will tell you they can get you a work visa but you must check
to see if they have the papers that enables them to hire and employ western people. this certificate is issued
to them by the govt and if they have that then they can get you one but it will involve a trip back home. so
dont let anyone tell you different and from my sources in the govt here in GZ this will probably change after
the asian games this year. but you cant have a guarantee on that. the govt here moves as fast as a herd of
turtles stampeding thru peanut butter.:icon_cheesygrin:
Thank You this is what my research so far has lead me to think but was not sure. The school where I am taking the tesl corse Guarantees employment with a government college for anyone with a masters degree from a U.S College. I did not know about the certificate issued to the schools from the govt. thanks for your advise.
-
Lee, with all that education behind you, It won't be a problem, but as I see it, you might end up working for the government.
by the way what are you going to do about all those beautiful horses?
-
Lee,
what school and were is it at in China were you will be going?
i will do some checking for you at this end to see what type of
school and its history as you know these places are a dime a
dozen here in China along with online courses. i do know the colleges
in Guangzhou that are govt run or backed depending how you look
at it dont require a tefl or tesol certificate if you have a degree so
that kind of concerns me??
-
Lee,
what school and were is it at in China were you will be going?
i will do some checking for you at this end to see what type of
school and its history as you know these places are a dime a
dozen here in China along with online courses. i do know the colleges
in Guangzhou that are govt run or backed depending how you look
at it dont require a tefl or tesol certificate if you have a degree so
that kind of concerns me??
College is not asking me to get TESL but I have never taught before so I thought it would not hurt.
TEFL International,
c/o Gateway Language Village
Ningxi Road, Xiangzhou
People's Republic of China
This is where I am taking tesl course
and the college that is offering the job is Zhuhai College of Beijing Normal University 18 class hrs, plus english corner 2 days a week and 4 hrs office hrs. 9000 rmb a month plus housing.
Not sure of what the housing is at this point.
I have no Idea if this is a standard deal or not would apreciate any input.
-
the 18 hours is pretty much standard which will with prep time take up the whole week.
office time added into this and the english corner is an additional time that will take up
almost another day depending on the scheduling time when you break it down your
making about 48 rmb an hour also check on the apartment because some schools
provide housing but charge you for water,electric,gas,cable tv, security based on square meter
which is usually 1rmb per sq meter and also building maintenance which is usually the same
so when you get paid its like this
9000
-800 utilities
- 75- security
- 75-garbage
- 420 taxes (1% of wages over 4800 rmb)
---------------------------------------
7630 net rmb deposited in your account
this now takes you to about 35 rmb per hour maybe 40 the only large descrepency will
be in the utilities were they try
and make extra money.
see if they will pay you for the english corner as some are open to this and it takes more
time than one would think to do especially 2 times a week. but at least you get the work visa
i hope and i would get that in the contract that they dont have to have you go back to the
states to do. a lot of schools say they will and then come back and say they cant get it
figuring that you will stay anyway because you are here. the end of this year with the asian
games is not exactly the best time to be doing this without the proper papers. a good question
to ask what do i do while your getting my z visa if asked. if they say "just tell them you are observing"
"and not teaching" then in all probability they will not get you a work visa.
-
Lee, with all that education behind you, It won't be a problem, but as I see it, you might end up working for the government.
by the way what are you going to do about all those beautiful horses?
My horses will be taken care of by my farm hands. I have leased out my land but I still have 2 farm hands that run the feed lots. They currently are taking care of the horses and I don't see why that should change.
the 18 hours is pretty much standard which will with prep time take up the whole week.
office time added into this and the english corner is an additional time that will take up
almost another day depending on the scheduling time when you break it down your
making about 48 rmb an hour also check on the apartment because some schools
provide housing but charge you for water,electric,gas,cable tv, security based on square meter
which is usually 1rmb per sq meter and also building maintenance which is usually the same
so when you get paid its like this
9000
-800 utilities
- 75- security
- 75-garbage
- 420 taxes (1% of wages over 4800 rmb)
---------------------------------------
7630 net rmb deposited in your account
this now takes you to about 35 rmb per hour maybe 40 the only large descrepency will
be in the utilities were they try
and make extra money.
see if they will pay you for the english corner as some are open to this and it takes more
time than one would think to do especially 2 times a week. but at least you get the work visa
i hope and i would get that in the contract that they dont have to have you go back to the
states to do. a lot of schools say they will and then come back and say they cant get it
figuring that you will stay anyway because you are here. the end of this year with the asian
games is not exactly the best time to be doing this without the proper papers. a good question
to ask what do i do while your getting my z visa if asked. if they say "just tell them you are observing"
"and not teaching" then in all probability they will not get you a work visa.
This is very sound information I thank you. I called the contract officer at the college and she said that they will not pay extra for the english corner sessions but If I would agree to paying the utilities on the apartment they would drop one of the sessions and lower my office hours to 2 hrs. I asked about the apartment and she said that right now they would pay all apartment related costs per the contract (I have not seen nor signed anything yet). I also asked about if they had the certificate from the government to hire westerners. She told me yes and when asked if she would send a copy of the certificate when we decide on a final draft of the contract she said she would. I think that your advise is helping me ask the right questions right now and she seems to think I have a lot of knowledge about this proccess. I think it is helping me in the overal negotiations. Thank you I will owe you big time. She did tell me that I could pick the work visa up in hong kong though. When questioned further about my impression that this is not possible right now she told me that very rarely they do have problems with this when dealing with americans. If they can not do it then I would have to go home to get the visa. So I asked if that was an expense that the school would cover and she told me no. So I asked if the school would cover it if I agreed to 2 english corners a week and only 1 hr office hours. I know that the english corner sessions are very important to the schools as they use them to recuit new students with them. New students=more money. Simple economics. I am having fun with this really. A chinese trying to out negotiate an ald cow man. I have horse traded and negotiated with the best of them my whole life. Added bonus that I can speak fluent mandarin and she does not know it. I am pulling the old migrant worker trick on them right now. Me no speak madarin:huh: .
Linya seems to think that we could live very well on 5000 rmb a month and she advises me not to settle for less than that as a take home fiqure. Those of you already in that area could we live comfortably on 5000rmb a month take home? From the above fiqures I am already above that any way. Problem I have is I am still going to have to start negotiating for less time on the job so I can have more time to travel and enjoy my time with my new wife. Since this is actually why I am going to move there. You know try and avoid the whole missing her thing while the U.S imigration thing crawls along at the pace of a slug. My attorney assures me that since I own several holdings in the U.S and also own my farm that I will not have to work and stay in the U.S while the proccess is going on. Apperantly from reading other post this seems to be a concern for some. I do miss her already and it has been less than a week since I was with her. So I could not imagine not living with her as we wait for her to be able to come to the U.S.
-
Lee,
what part of the USA do you live in? this is relevant for your work visa. i looked on your info and it didnt say.
you could get the papers to the embassy in New York or the consulate in San Francisco. I can pretty much assure
you that you will be going back to get your work visa after the school prepares all the papers. They cannot be handled
by an attorney but only by yourself as it will take your passport and pictures. If i was you i would start the process for
your DOJ report that could take up to 6 weeks to obtain. Get the one for working in China or foreign countries. This is not
done at the federal building go on their web site and it will tell you were and who does this. it is done by electronically
submitting your fingerprints and then the DOJ mails you the report. This report is your complete background from when
you were first put in the registry and from evrywere you lived.You want the one with the raised seal on it not the regular
photo copy one as they probably wont take it.I actually got both of mine and found out the one with the seal is what they want when i got here. the sad thing with all these schools is they are pretty much like the agencies on chnlove full of crap and the info
changes daily. just prepare yourself for that. also find out when and what hours your classes will be because they do
want you to stay around the school between them. so if your first class is at 9am and the last at 8pm well thats a pretty
long day.Yes there are exceptions to the rule as some guys have found it a little different and will tell you different
but that is and are exceptions to the rule and is probably 5% of the teachers. i see it all the time or i should say often enough
around the embassy area were i hang out with people and you meet people who are going home to finish or are going home
because the school couldnt help them. i was fortunate to get mine when i was here but thats because of someone in the family
who knew someone who knew someone and will probably cost me down the road as i owe 3 favors but it was worth it as i can
stay and not fear getting caught working without it. they just fine you and send you home but you will not get another visa to
come here again if that happens. and to top it off i didnt go to work for a school after it was all done. you know if you tutor 10 hrs a week at 200 rmb
that is 8000 month net. just an idea for you after you arrive here.
as far as living here for 5000 rmb that is really good as your biggest expense (housing)( utilities) are being covered so
dont kick that gift horse in the mouth. it will depend on what you want to spend for food. i probably spend an extra 1000
rmb a month on food over the average person because i really dont care for nor like all chinese food so i buy quality steaks
and beef and pork that cost a little more for the house and we cook it in the oven i bought for the house. also my wife likes
to bake things in it and the ingredients for that stuff is a little pricy here. i eat about half of all the different chinese foods
that you could buy in GZ and not anything exotic at all. s it is manageable on 5000 rmb. my wife bought a house and lived good
when she was only making 4000 rmb a month and that was only 8 years ago. you could do that with 4000 rmb now but it would be tight
as prices of homes have gone up. now she makes more and lives the same saving everything else
-
Lee,
what part of the USA do you live in? this is relevant for your work visa. i looked on your info and it didnt say.
you could get the papers to the embassy in New York or the consulate in San Francisco. I can pretty much assure
you that you will be going back to get your work visa after the school prepares all the papers. They cannot be handled
by an attorney but only by yourself as it will take your passport and pictures. If i was you i would start the process for
your DOJ report that could take up to 6 weeks to obtain. Get the one for working in China or foreign countries. This is not
done at the federal building go on their web site and it will tell you were and who does this. it is done by electronically
submitting your fingerprints and then the DOJ mails you the report. This report is your complete background from when
you were first put in the registry and from evrywere you lived.You want the one with the raised seal on it not the regular
photo copy one as they probably wont take it.I actually got both of mine and found out the one with the seal is what they want when i got here. the sad thing with all these schools is they are pretty much like the agencies on chnlove full of crap and the info
changes daily. just prepare yourself for that. also find out when and what hours your classes will be because they do
want you to stay around the school between them. so if your first class is at 9am and the last at 8pm well thats a pretty
long day.Yes there are exceptions to the rule as some guys have found it a little different and will tell you different
but that is and are exceptions to the rule and is probably 5% of the teachers. i see it all the time or i should say often enough
around the embassy area were i hang out with people and you meet people who are going home to finish or are going home
because the school couldnt help them. i was fortunate to get mine when i was here but thats because of someone in the family
who knew someone who knew someone and will probably cost me down the road as i owe 3 favors but it was worth it as i can
stay and not fear getting caught working without it. they just fine you and send you home but you will not get another visa to
come here again if that happens. and to top it off i didnt go to work for a school after it was all done. you know if you tutor 10 hrs a week at 200 rmb
that is 8000 month net. just an idea for you after you arrive here.
as far as living here for 5000 rmb that is really good as your biggest expense (housing)( utilities) are being covered so
dont kick that gift horse in the mouth. it will depend on what you want to spend for food. i probably spend an extra 1000
rmb a month on food over the average person because i really dont care for nor like all chinese food so i buy quality steaks
and beef and pork that cost a little more for the house and we cook it in the oven i bought for the house. also my wife likes
to bake things in it and the ingredients for that stuff is a little pricy here. i eat about half of all the different chinese foods
that you could buy in GZ and not anything exotic at all. s it is manageable on 5000 rmb. my wife bought a house and lived good
when she was only making 4000 rmb a month and that was only 8 years ago. you could do that with 4000 rmb now but it would be tight
as prices of homes have gone up. now she makes more and lives the same saving everything else
The attorney is not handling the visa for china but the visa for my soon to be wife to return to the states. I Live in Oregon so the San Fransisco consulate is where I have to go to. I have a friend in the DOJ and I will ask her to make sure I get the apropriate paper work. I think I may be alot like you I want to be there without worrying about being deported and not being able to return. I am only doing this so I can stay with my wife until the U.S is done taking its time proccessing her imagration paperwork. I have read that it can take a long time. I do apreciate your help. And I am enjoying the negotiation with the school even if I don't end up working there. The form of negotiation used is quite enjoyable. Never coming right out and saying what you want but still getting your point accross so that there is no mistaking what is wanted. Very different from here.
-
Lee,
if you dont mind keep me posted on what develops with your school. i am just
curious how it turns out with you speaking and asking the right questions to
them. i dont think they are accustomed to that :icon_cheesygrin:
Ted
-
To be honest I don't think they are either. If it was not for this site I would not have known the real important questions to ask either and might have ended up with a less than ideal outcome. Like we need any more uncertainty than moving and living in a new country and having to deal with two different governments, and learning how to live with a woman with a completely different way of thinking than at least I have ever been with before.
By the way I have been told I will be getting married on October 23 2010 at 4:32pm. I am not entirely sure why this date and time but Linya tells me that she took my birth chart and hers to a fortune teller and this is the time and date she suggests. so this is the date and time of my wedding. Knowing Linya as I do I have absolutly no doubt all the wedding ceremonies will progress right on a tight schedule. So, I am sure that at the moment the clock strikes 4:32 in the afternoon someone will be saying we are married. :icon_cheesygrin:
-
Lee357,
These Chinese women are good at organising things .... but they ain't that good!! ...lol!!!
Your officially married when the registrar hands you your Red Books, and No-One can predict or plan what time that's going to be. As for the reception, well that CAN be planned and organised, if the guests are willing to be organised that well, and don't get hungry before hand...lol!!
Strange how they still go to these fortune tellers to find out if your a good match and set dates for weddings and things. You would think they would know better by now, considering the amount of divorces, and the fact that those figures are increasing year on year!! Still, ...who are we to complain? ...hahaha!!
David.....
-
David,
a little heads up on that. if she knows people at the agency they can arrange for
them to recieve their books at that time and get it at the time she wants if she
wants to stick with the fortune teller time
-
Ted,
I must admit, .... that scenario didn't even enter my mind!! It's so easy to forget that with contacts and a bit of money thrown in the right direction, can often negate what seems unlikely to near impossible to just another item on the list ticked off and ''Done''...hahaha!!
David....
-
David,
it is true what they accomplish when they want to and it is
usually something out of the norm
Ted
-
Well I do not know if she will really get it done I was just commenting on how she schedules her life and is now so very focused on this wedding. I know that she insisted Last night that I must be ready on the wedding day by 6:30 am so that I could keep to the schedule. I mean really 6:30 in the morning and we are not supposed to be married until 4:32 in the afternoon. What did I get myself into here. I have experience in the culture of the Chinese but I have never known about most of the things she tells me are required of me. By the way yes she actually said required of me. Not I would like you to, or could you please, just you are required to do these things. I have never been on such a short honeymoon before. :icon_biggrin: I guess I should have paid better attention to the posts about what comes after, instead of just on how to get through the communicating stage. I don't even get as many letters or web cam time with her any more. She is too busy with work so she can have time off for the wedding and then the time she is dedicating to planning the wedding. I still get the daily phone call but even that has started to get shorter and later in the night. Mind you I am not complaining but she never showed this much determination about our relationship before she was sure we would get married. It is almost like I released some kind of Tasmanian devil. :icon_cheesygrin:
To be honest I have just started to read and educate myself on these things. I have all along took a cursory glance at the post about the wedding and other such things because I was so focused on the chase I pretty much forgot to find out what it was going to take to get her in the boat. :icon_cheesygrin: sorry for the fishing clichés I am going to Alaska for a few days next month to go fly fishing. By the way can one go fishing in China, another thing I have never thought about until I decided to move there? I am beginning to believe I was a little too sure of my experience as a tourist in china to consider all these little things before I decided to move there. Egg on my face for a little too much of that American arrogance.
If you are new to this like I still am remember to pay attention to what a traditional wedding is and realize that there is way more to it than a traditional western wedding. I would even say start early researching about it along with reading the post about how to get the woman of your dreams. Get yourself mentally prepared so that when it happens, and I do believe that if you stick with it, it will happen for you. You are ready for this experience. Or at least as ready as you can be. :huh:
I would also like to add we did talk about weddings and such issues before I went over to meet her. She was as usual always vague and submissive about it, until we met and she was sure that she loved me and that I loved her and then that submissive thing went right out the window about the wedding. She is still submissive about a lot of things just not the wedding. It is her first and I think that like in western cultures maybe mom has a lot of say in how things will go at the wedding. I am not sure at this point because I am afraid to ask and upset her apple cart. I think I would pay for that transgression for the rest of my life. I am generally taking the attitude that just like in western culture the day is in the end all about her, or it is after all her day. I just happen to be the one that is there to support her and to be honest make her look so beautiful by comparison to this fat American standing next to her. :angel:
-
Lee, you are right. it is her day so just give her the money she needs and get out of the way. Of course this is only the start. Once married, she is the boss but will make you feel like you are. they are great at the manipulation so dont be surprised when you find yourself doing everything she wants, but thinking you made the decision. I finally just gave up. Called her the boss, give her the money and live on her love. You wont regret it.
-
so true !!!
I'm back home now, as of last Wednesday and I am thinking about the million good things that have happened to me in the past 2 weeks, when I get my breath back I will share it with you all.
But I had to respond to this thread, because I can completely understand now what you are saying.
I was amazed about the change that came over Ming once she got the ring on her finger !!!
Not that anything bad happened...quite the contrary, she was totally focussed on making sure that i was comfortable in everything and that all the daily stuff went smoothly and easily.
But I could not help noticing the subtle change in the environment...she had quietly, confidently taken charge of just about everything !!!
For a crusty old Bachelor like me...it was a surprise and many times I had to obey the Maxx rule...but not 24 hours...more like 2 minutes !!!
I just went with the flow and tried my dammnest to adjust and get used to being spoiled in this way....and to avoid trying to get into a debate about equality, roles etc etc etc...it didn't do any good. !! She has her way of being the "Boss" and I aint gonna change it. But it is nice really, I just got to get used to it.
But still the major decisions are clearly my province...she often says "you must decide" to issues that go beyond daily stuff...maybe thats how it should be...and I sure aint complaining.
David
-
Lee, you are right. it is her day so just give her the money she needs and get out of the way. Of course this is only the start. Once married, she is the boss but will make you feel like you are. they are great at the manipulation so dont be surprised when you find yourself doing everything she wants, but thinking you made the decision. I finally just gave up. Called her the boss, give her the money and live on her love. You wont regret it.
Thank you, I am sure I will love being married to her. I don't mind giving up control of things to her. She is by far more organized than I am. I already found out she is a master at getting me to do what she wants. To see that all you need to do is read the begining of this thread.
-
I had a major problem with some of that at first. Like the red envelope. to the point that I called off the wedding for a while. Finally I talked to Dinger and he suggested to just give her the money, tell her that is it and let her do what she wants to do. I dont regret that decision at all. That is why I give that to you. If you want to fight it, you will regret it.
The major decisions are your province, like where you will live and what house, but after that let her take it from there. you will both be very happy you did. Especially if you are going to live in China. YOU are the stranger. It was recently pointed out to me (by a friend) that I have no business being upset at some of these things as I am the one intruding on thousands of years of tradition, it was our choice to come here, they didnt drag us. I had not thought of it that way before. So now I just go along with it. Some of it I still do not like, but there you go.
-
But still the major decisions are clearly my province...she often says "you must decide" to issues that go beyond daily stuff...maybe thats how it should be...and I sure aint complaining.
David
Doesn't that drive you crazy? I talked to Sha last night about my upcoming trip. (Leave next Friday, by the way) I don't know how many times she said "you decide". I keep telling her I want her opinion on things, but she just smiles and says again "you decide". Jeez!
Don
-
You decide. Just make sure you decide the correct way - her way!!!!
:icon_cheesygrin:
Willy
-
Hahaha!!, ....I've just been having a little chuckle to myself here reading what your saying about these Chinese women, and how they can have you and your life organised in short order!!...lol!!
Get used to it lads, because it doesn't stop, anything to do with family, home, health, etc etc, is going to come under her control, ...like it or not!! lol!! They will rarely ask you about anything, they just go right ahead and do it, you will only be told/informed as a late after thought...
Just wait till you come home from work one night, you have a quick shower and change in to your lounging around the home gear. You just get yourself settled in your favorite chair and start relaxing for the night, when out of the blue your Chinese wife tells you ...Oh!! so and so is coming round tonight for dinner, ...or Oh!! were going out tonight, to so and so's for dinner!!!
Now this evening had been planned by her for maybe day's or even weeks, but you only find out maybe half an hour to an hour before..... It took me around 2 years to get her out of that habit, so now i get to find out maybe the day before the event, ...i can live with that ..lol!!!
I've found it easier to ask her, (normally of a morning) what's planned or going on for her today, you'll be amazed what you'll find out by doing this sort of thing!! ...hahaha!!
Best of luck to all of you, i think you've all got lot's to learn, especially after your married and living together full time. ....Just ask Maxx, Ted, and some of the others. It's only after your married (living together) that your relationship really starts. One thing for sure, it's gonna be nothing like your visits to China to be with your wife, ...There holidays!!!... hahaha!!
David......
-
Doesn't that drive you crazy? I talked to Sha last night about my upcoming trip. (Leave next Friday, by the way) I don't know how many times she said "you decide". I keep telling her I want her opinion on things, but she just smiles and says again "you decide". Jeez!
Don
[/quote]
Enjoy your trip!
I get that from Linya a lot too. Especially on questions about issues that relate to my moving ect.. not the wedding and I have accepted that and just sent her a few thousand as she requested to get the whole thing done. I thought that dad was paying for half but apparently She told him no that we could do it on our own. I am grateful though that she at least called and asked how much I was willing to spend on the wedding. I think I was lucky that I must have chose a good number because she actually squealed when I told her, and I thought it sounded pretty low. Still thinking in western terms. My only other wedding set me back at least 3 times that much. Linya promises me it will not cost any more than that so I am happy. Maxx your 24 hour rule works good now only when she is willing to give me 24 hours to respond in letters not so good on the phone at this point. I would have come on here and asked what a good number would be so I don't pay too much but no such luck she needed an answer right now. I do so love this woman and yes I am still so whipped and loving every minute of it. :icon_cheesygrin:
Hahaha!!, ....I've just been having a little chuckle to myself here reading what your saying about these Chinese women, and how they can have you and your life organised in short order!!...lol!!
Get used to it lads, because it doesn't stop, anything to do with family, home, health, etc etc, is going to come under her control, ...like it or not!! lol!! They will rarely ask you about anything, they just go right ahead and do it, you will only be told/informed as a late after thought...
Just wait till you come home from work one night, you have a quick shower and change in to your lounging around the home gear. You just get yourself settled in your favorite chair and start relaxing for the night, when out of the blue your Chinese wife tells you ...Oh!! so and so is coming round tonight for dinner, ...or Oh!! were going out tonight, to so and so's for dinner!!!
Now this evening had been planned by her for maybe day's or even weeks, but you only find out maybe half an hour to an hour before..... It took me around 2 years to get her out of that habit, so now i get to find out maybe the day before the event, ...i can live with that ..lol!!!
I've found it easier to ask her, (normally of a morning) what's planned or going on for her today, you'll be amazed what you'll find out by doing this sort of thing!! ...hahaha!!
Best of luck to all of you, i think you've all got lot's to learn, especially after your married and living together full time. ....Just ask Maxx, Ted, and some of the others. It's only after your married (living together) that your relationship really starts. One thing for sure, it's gonna be nothing like your visits to China to be with your wife, ...There holidays!!!... hahaha!!
David......
Thanks for the insight David. I think I might need this forum more now and after than I ever did before. Still the same Lady I fell in love with but a whole lot different in other ways. I knew that change would happen it always does be it western women or Eastern women in the end they are women and once they get the ring they do change. I do think this change is good. She is all about us now and with at least my first wife it definitely became about her after we decided to get married. So I see it as a positive.
-
Visiting and living together are worlds apart. the visits are just a quick holiday
but when you marry and live together the adventure begins. but i will say that
the adventure is very well worth it. sometimes confusing, sometimes exciting,
sometimes chaotic, but in all honesty it is worth every minute when you have
a very kind,loving,big hearted chinese lady as your wife.:icon_biggrin:
Maxx's 24 hour rule doesnt apply to often when your together as it will change
to the 2.4 minute rule when she wants an answer to her question you dont understand.
and sometimes i chuckle to myself when Sisi says "you decide" i say "ok" then later i
will ask her "so what are we doing' and she tells me hahahahha so i guess i did decide.
i gave her a few more hours to think about what we will do :icon_cheesygrin: its a little
work but worth it in to many ways to mention here as the post would be to long
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I was just rereading this post from the first one I posted here and was struck by how far I have come with you guys help in just a little less than one month and how far my relationship with Linya has changed in such a short time. in my first post I was nervous and full of doubt about what the right thing to do was and you all helped me find the answer that I knew all along. To my last post one of total acceptance of the path this ride is taking. Once again with lots of advise from you guys. I also can see where I am going to need to lean on you guys in the future so I wanted to thank all of you who have responded to this thread and have helped me get through all of this in such a short amount of time. I am not one that usually adapts to this much change so fast. It has been a blessing having people who have been there helping me understand and shining a light on the path I am traveling. To those who will respond to help me in the future let me thank you in advance for your guidance. I will certainly try to help those coming behind me in the same spirit that you have helped me in so far.
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Lee,
Out of curiosity, what was the number you quoted her? I think those of us who aren't married yet want an idea of how much it'll cost. :icon_biggrin:
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Lee,
Out of curiosity, what was the number you quoted her? I think those of us who aren't married yet want an idea of how much it'll cost. :icon_biggrin:
3000 USD. Now keep in mind that also covers the agency fee. So in reality about 2000 for the weeding and 1000 to pay off her debt to the agency. I am sure that now that she has the money she will negotiate the agency fee down some and add that money to the wedding costs.
so true !!!
I'm back home now, as of last Wednesday and I am thinking about the million good things that have happened to me in the past 2 weeks, when I get my breath back I will share it with you all.
But I had to respond to this thread, because I can completely understand now what you are saying.
I was amazed about the change that came over Ming once she got the ring on her finger !!!
Not that anything bad happened...quite the contrary, she was totally focussed on making sure that i was comfortable in everything and that all the daily stuff went smoothly and easily.
But I could not help noticing the subtle change in the environment...she had quietly, confidently taken charge of just about everything !!!
For a crusty old Bachelor like me...it was a surprise and many times I had to obey the Maxx rule...but not 24 hours...more like 2 minutes !!!
I just went with the flow and tried my dammnest to adjust and get used to being spoiled in this way....and to avoid trying to get into a debate about equality, roles etc etc etc...it didn't do any good. !! She has her way of being the "Boss" and I aint gonna change it. But it is nice really, I just got to get used to it.
But still the major decisions are clearly my province...she often says "you must decide" to issues that go beyond daily stuff...maybe thats how it should be...and I sure aint complaining.
David
Congratulations David. I am happy that it has worked out for you too. Acceptance I think that is going to be my new motto through all of this. Just accept that she is in charge of what she wants to be in charge of and I just get to be in charge of what she wants me to be in charge of. :icon_biggrin:
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Lee357,
You could be so very right there, ...Everything is negotiable in China, especially where money is concerned... And it's always better for the money to be in your pocket than in theirs ...Right??
Hahahaha!!!
David
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Lee first of congradulations.The money for the wedding is right in where it should be..Your going to have good time.And like the rest of the guys ben telling you the real living stats after your married and living together.
It's taken me almost 4 years to get my wifes input.On money matters.But everything else she is right there with her opinion wether I want it or not.And she does take care of all the social function.And when we will go to China.What doctor the kids will see.All the mudane regular stuff.When we go to China.Every day is planned out.To almost the minute.And like David said I have no idea what we are doing until she tells me.The social function she has ben good at telling me about in the states.But not in China.So I just try to flow with it.It seams to work out good for me and my wife.
The only thing you really have to watch for with my wife.Is don't let her get to tired or Hungrey.If she is to tired or hungrey.There is no peace until the situation is fixed.
David50, Ted, Sarge, Peter, Willy Hajo,And Brian.You all have spent enough time.With your wives to not even need the 24 hour rule.Iv'e spent enough time with my wife.Where I can give her a answer in about 2 minutes.And about 90% of the time it is the right answer.The only time I get in trouble is the other 10%.Then all hell breaks lose
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Maxx,
thats why i say the 2.4 minute rule after you have spent the time living with your wife:icon_cheesygrin:
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$2000 isn't too bad. Just trying to get a feel for what the budget should be. Thanks!
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when mine gets tired she gets the same way Maxx
when she gets hungry we just stop at the nearest
chinese restuarant and eat.
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Yes!! this is another very Chinese phenomenon, they love to ''Eat'', and they eat at any time all day long!! Which is why ALL the restaurants are open all day long in China and Hong Kong.
As others have mentioned, they get a bit ratty if there tummy is telling them it needs topping up!! haha!! Guess that's why they eat little, but very often throughout the day. Sometimes it only needs to be a bit of fruit like an Orange, Banana etc, but other times it will need to be a bit more substantial...haha!!
I don't know if others have noticed or not, but when i eat Chinese, i'm only full for maybe 2 or 3 hours, then i'm feeling hungry again!! Even noticed this years back, whenever i had a Chinese meal at a restaurant, or a takeaway back in the UK....
David...
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Yes, we did a big thread on that a while ago. I noticed that as soon as we would come home from a restaurant, or finish a meal, she would grab something to snack on. An orange, seeds of any kind, apples, etc. that would continue until the next meal when she would say she was very hungry. I couldnt get over it. At meals she would eat a ton of food. I was surprised that she wasnt 200 lbs, as much as she eats. But their metabolism is just different. Now my wife has gained some weight, which of course she blames on me. She says she is so happy that she eats a lot. I told her bull, she just likes to eat. lol. Qingqing is rail thin, but she also eats a lot. now true it is what they eat and how it is prepared that helps keep them thin. But it still amazes me.
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so true !!!
I'm back home now, as of last Wednesday and I am thinking about the million good things that have happened to me in the past 2 weeks, when I get my breath back I will share it with you all.
But I had to respond to this thread, because I can completely understand now what you are saying.
I was amazed about the change that came over Ming once she got the ring on her finger !!!
Not that anything bad happened...quite the contrary, she was totally focussed on making sure that i was comfortable in everything and that all the daily stuff went smoothly and easily.
But I could not help noticing the subtle change in the environment...she had quietly, confidently taken charge of just about everything !!!
For a crusty old Bachelor like me...it was a surprise and many times I had to obey the Maxx rule...but not 24 hours...more like 2 minutes !!!
I just went with the flow and tried my dammnest to adjust and get used to being spoiled in this way....and to avoid trying to get into a debate about equality, roles etc etc etc...it didn't do any good. !! She has her way of being the "Boss" and I aint gonna change it. But it is nice really, I just got to get used to it.
But still the major decisions are clearly my province...she often says "you must decide" to issues that go beyond daily stuff...maybe thats how it should be...and I sure aint complaining.
David
Congratulations David! This was trip number 6 right? Maybe we can throw a newly weds party soon :icon_cheesygrin:
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Voiceroveip,
Trip number 6, but trip number 1, or his first visit for this lady (Ming). And i get the very strong feeling there won't be any need to visit any other ladies from now on either!! haha!!
The other 5 trips were classified by Dave as dismal failures, So i guess trip 6 is the out and out success he was hoping for and GOT!!
David....
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I don't know if others have noticed or not, but when i eat Chinese, i'm only full for maybe 2 or 3 hours, then i'm feeling hungry again!! Even noticed this years back, whenever i had a Chinese meal at a restaurant, or a takeaway back in the UK....
David...
I think it depends on the person. I usually get hungry again within two hours when I have vietnamese foods... Not sure why. Also the more processed foods have a similar effect... but if I eat something "rustic-style", it tends to last me much longer (4-6 hours...sometimes more)
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mustfocus,
Well Vietnamese and Chinese food is very similar in there content, so i guess would be similar in the effects on satisfying the tummy, ....or lack of it!! ..hahaha!!
David....
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i am usually hungry again within 3 hours after eating
and my wife is like Jims she is picking up a little weight
but says its my fault because of the western food i cook
at home with the oven we bought. has nothing to do with
the ton of food she can eat hahaha
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Ok guys I have just been pumped for an EMF charge by a translator that has been nothing but honest up till now. As you all know I am getting married to my Lady and she has been very busy with work and wedding plans and all. So we have not written each other on CL for about a month since we have been talking on the phone and ETC. So I get this EMF tonight out of the Blue while I am on the phone with my Lady. It is even signed with her English name and we have not used that in months. My lady is going to go down to the agency tomorrow and tear them a new one. This letter is part compilation of other letters and some current things. It came with generic photos off the internet. So here is the letter.
My dearest Lee
Because of tired and busy, I was sick these two days, but it's not serious, I just haven't the appetite to eat, meanwhile, my head is heavy, I took some medicines and I feel better and better, please believe in me that you are in my mind always. meanwhile, please forgive me. I not neglect you.
Do you know my Lee, today is the lanterns festival and it's the first festival after the spring festival in the new year. we eat the tuanyuan dumplings, watch the red lanterns and dragon dance, I wonder have you ever watched them. here I have some pictures about them for you, I wish you will love them. meanwhile, I wish we will be together the next lanterns festival. how do you think about it?
So, how are you these days my lee? are you very busy with your work? how is your daughter? when you got my letter please don't forget send her my best wishes. I know you worry about me, I can always feel your love here, really thank you for making me feel so happy, once again, please forgive me for my later reply, I will write to you soon
Yours always
****
:@ :@ :@ :@ :@
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Lee wow I wonder how the agency is going to talk themselves out of that.That's pretty blatant fraud.One of my concerns is your lady will go down to the agency and rip them a new one.
If your lady goes to the agency and rips them a new one.The agency will know that you have ben to China.Then the agency will want the meet and greet fee.Then the agency will also want the marriage fee.In some of these agencies the meet and greet fee and the marriage fee can be several thousand Rmb.And they will hound and threaten the lady until the fees are payed.
One way around all this drama is.Talk to your lady.Tell her not to go to the agency.Tell her not to worry about it.That you two will only talk on the phone or on the computer with web cam.And her personal email.(Not the agency controlled email)After you have talked to your fiancee.All you have to do is block your fiancee profile.That will keep the translator from sending you letters.And burning up credits.
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Yes, Lee, her going to the agency is EXACTLY what they want. That or you replying. Information is power, and they are fishing for information.
When my fiancee and I got off EMFs, I received 3 fake EMFs from the agency over a two month period. Darling, I haven't heard from you for a while. Have you forgotten me? I will never forget you, I still love you, blah, blah, blah. My lady knew nothing about these until I told her. Fishing. If I had replied or if she had given them grief, that would have been exactly what they wanted. The promise of a crock of gold at the end of the EMF rainbow.
The only answer is silence. Depriving them of information deprives them of the oxygen they need and eventually they give up.
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I paid the meet and greet fee while in country with her and she has the money I sent her to pay the marriage fee right now. I think she is going to use this as a way to negotiate the fee down considerably. I know that either way she is very mad and there is no way I am going to be able to stop her from going down to the agency.
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Oh ... these Lady's when it comes to Dishonesty and Money , watch out and don't get in their way .
I see Maxx is a little late to stop you , but he is exactly right and should be well concidered by other in the same or near the same issue/situation . I'm still upset what my Wife had to Pay her Agency for the Marriage Fee , even though she thinks they deserved it . It was forty thousand Yuan , which I would have never let her Pay ..if I only knew ahead of time . One more thing , everyone should find out before going from their Lady ... HOW much all those Fee's are adding up to ? Well too late now , but not for other's .
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I remember when I was in Baoding with Xu Le she would not got to the agency. At the time I did not understand why she didnt want to go there. But now as I look back on it, it was smart in her part. She new what was going to happen and she didnt want to pay for those fees.
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Arnold,
You didn't actually pay 40k RMB surely???... They might ask for that sort of money, but it doesn't mean you pay it!!! I've never known anyone pay more than 15k, and even then, i reckon they were lucky to get that!!!
Where money is conserned you ''ALWAYS'' negotiate, ... and you NEVER pay what they first ask for!! In fact, where that sort of money is involved, the Chinese Expect to negotiate....
David....
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David ,
re-read my last Post here , you misunderstood it . Qing pay'd it and she told me not till she was here with me .. when I finanlly ask her that question of the cost's . If I would have know it sooner ... she would have had a big chance to see me Mad and Upset , what she wanted to see . After the sign-up Fee and the meeting Fee , I would never have given them more than maybe $ 500 at most and if they complained about it ... see those two "0" 's ... watch them come off like magic . haha
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Arnold,
Yes i got the wrong end of the stick!!...!!! haha!! I'll have to slow down my speed reading, especially where money is conserned ...lol!!
David.....
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:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
don't we all do that sometimes ? Especially when we are day-dreaming about a Lady . :icon_cheesygrin:
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Arnold,Phillip, And David you are all making good points.And everybody does need to be aware of this.By the agencies enticing the ladies to come back in.And complain it opens the door for the agencies to get more money.
Another favorite tactic of some of the agencies is your buddy the translator.Will send you admiration mails from different ladies.Even with your profile closed.They get the same exact results.You tell your lady.She gets mad.Goes to the agency.The agency says oh we are so sorry.You didn't pay the meet and greet fee.So we didn't know.
If your lady tells them where to get off at.That she isn't paying them any fees.That's when the threats start.We will block your visa application.We will garnish your wages.We will take the money from your bank account.We will tell the police and have you arrested.
These are all threats that hold no merit.The agency has nothing to do with the visa process.Or any power to stop it.They can't garnish the ladies wages.They can't even withdraw the money from the ladies bank account.And nine out of ten of these agencies are not going to get the police involved.Because as me and Willy have stated on more then one occasion.These agencies do not have the proper license to introduce foreigners to Chinese nationals.
If they did get the police involved.The police would start investigating why said agency is introducing foreigners.Then there is a good possibility the agency will have to close it's doors.And somebody is going to jail.Or be fined out of business.
David50 makes a good point.If you and your lady are in the position where you are going to have to pay the meet and greet fee along with the marriage fee.Negotiate the fee.This is expected in China.The madder you act the cheaper it is going to be.Because now the agency is scared you are going to complain to the police.
Sometime it doe's pay to be a foreigner in China.
Maxx
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I would have come on here first and brought it up but I reacted to the emf while I was on the phone with her. We were talking about living arrangements during the wedding and I got a notice of mail. I looked and then before reading it I said "oh, you sent me a letter" to this came the reply "no I did not" the rest was history. I negotiated the meet and greet fee down to a hundred US. They wanted about 500. I had already discused with my lady what they wanted and we decided I would just say no I just won't talk with the lady anymore and you can get it out of her. They took what I offered. The marriage fee is 10k but she thought before this she could get them down to at most 800. Last night after this email came she thinks she can get them down to 500 and help with the planning of the wedding for free. My lady works for the local government and says she knows a whole lot about the local and provincial laws. I am glad that my posting this situation sparked conversation again about things us newbes need to think about and how what I still think is an honest agency, in the whole, will try to do when they think you are trying to cheat them. I am a little surprised at the move since they were told that we would be getting married in oct. And I would talk to them about the marriage fee at that time. Maybe after the meet and greet negotiation they might have thought it would be better for them to negotiate with my lady. I think they are wrong now that they pissed her off.
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Guys
Here we touch on one of the great flaws in the Chinese mentality...whenever money is involved.
David 5O and I have had many dealings with Chinese Businesses, sometimes for Contracts worth many Millions.
What we have both found is that they may think they are very smart and shrewd when setting up a deal and screwing your A ** off...but when it comes to the crunch, the detail or the too-often temptation to try and screw a little more...even at the expense of a total failure of the whole deal......overtakes their common sense...it is something they cant seem to resist !!!!
So they think they have you by the B***s and sooner or later , greed takes over and they blow it all !!
I think they still have a lot to learn about "negotiation" despite being able to get something for 2 RMB less than the advertised price :icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
David
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Update!!
I just got off the phone with my lady and she got them to take 300 usd for the marriage fee but no help with the wedding which is just fine with her. They told her it was a different translator who sent the EMF and fired one right on the spot. If that was the one that actually sent it or if they will get their job back as soon as she left I have no idea. we talked about it and she does not want me to block her untill I am there and we are married. I think She is still hedging her bets just incase it does not work. For instance I can't make it or something like that. She was very evasive about the whole blocking her profile thing. So I have sent a complaint to CL but I am sure that it will come to nothing, but I fiqured my search is over so I should try and make a difference for those who are still out there. Mind you I still feel that the agency she is or was with is still a honest one in the whole. This is the first time I have ever felt like they were not being somewhat honest with me. I honestly feel that somewhat honest is the best we can hope for with these agencies.
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Lee357,
Hahaha!! ....These ladies certainly know how to negotiate, and they can be devastating, when they have a lever to squeeze them with. So, she walked out of her agency with a better than expected result, makes you wonder, what she first offered them, ....I bet it had the boss's face drop about a mile and a half!!! lol!!!
Let everyone here remember, Never, Ever, Ever pay what is first asked for, or what your lady contracted to pay. That figure was always going to be exaggerated, in the hope of a rich foreigner (real or otherwise) stumping up that fee. The agency and the ladies knew that the lady was, in 9 cases out of ten, never able to pay that figure...../
David.......
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exactly David they do know the lady cannot pay the fee by themselves
and are hedging their bets that a man from the west would be stupid
enough to pay an extremely large fee to them. the translator that was
fired was probably hired back the same day. they really dont have a large
pool of people to pull from for that job. especially the agencies in smaller
cities
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Ok, I just got the teaching contract in the mail today. It offers; a 3 bed room apartment everything included (security, utilities, Internet, western toilet, kitchen, sitting room {I think this is the living room}, maintenance), 9000 rmb monthly salary. I need to do; 18 teaching hours, 2 office hours, 1 English corner session a week, be a judge for the university English competition (extra pay for that). Classes are spread out so my day would be from 0800 to 1600 5 days a week, so this makes for a full time job as they prefer I don’t leave between classes. I have a feeling during the off hours is when they will try to get freebies out of me. The old “since you are here and are not doing anything” routine to try and pressure me into doing free lessons or tutoring or something else like that. Days off are Sunday and Monday so at least 2 off in a row. They do have a certificate to hire foreigners but I will need to send it to a friend I have made at the Chinese embassy in San Fransisco to be sure. It is written in simplified Chinese script that I can somewhat read but I would not know if it was real even if I could read it all. They will give me all the appropriate documentation that the consulate will need for me to get my work permit and Work visa prior to my leaving in October. They will take care of a residency permit once I am there. I did not know about any work permit before receiving this contract, can someone tell me what this is for? Sounds like another “get more money from the foreigner” thing. They will also take care of any issues that the local Government has when I get there. So now for the question, does this sound like a good offer? It has taken me a couple of weeks to negotiate it with them. I asked for the 5 day week and offered a 2nd English corner to get it but it looks like they just gave it to me without the extra English corner. There is no mention of “other duties as assigned” or anything that resembles that. I am happy with the deal but I am worried about a clause that says they can send me to another campus if there are no positions available at the Zhuhai campus. This clause does state that they can only temporarily assign me for no longer than 1 term and only twice during the contract. The wording just seems suspect to me. Oh and they will reimburse travel expenses.
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were are the other campuses at ?? i think maybe that means you will travel withi town to teach
your classes if they dont have any onsight. usually term means 6 months so it means they can reassign you 2 times in the year
all the paperwork is paid for by the school. or should be all you need to do is file it at the consulate along
with your passport and you get it back with your z visa in it. the registry is quick and simple once you arrive there.
all schools require you to stay on campus so thats why i tell evryone dont check class amount
check the times. they do have classes up till 10 pm so if your first one is say 9am to 9.45 am and your next is
8pm til 845 pm then thats a long day.
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were are the other campuses at ?? i think maybe that means you will travel withi town to teach
your classes if they dont have any onsight. usually term means 6 months so it means they can reassign you 2 times in the year
all the paperwork is paid for by the school. or should be all you need to do is file it at the consulate along
with your passport and you get it back with your z visa in it. the registry is quick and simple once you arrive there.
all schools require you to stay on campus so thats why i tell evryone dont check class amount
check the times. they do have classes up till 10 pm so if your first one is say 9am to 9.45 am and your next is
8pm til 845 pm then thats a long day.
I don't know the exact times of the classes but in the contract I am required to be at the school only from 8 am untill 4 pm so it will be an 8 hour day. I insisted on that along with the 5 day work week. I offered consessions but they just gave me what I wanted and did not change what they wanted from me. I will look into if there is other locations.
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Ok, I just got the teaching contract in the mail today. It offers; a 3 bed room apartment everything included (security, utilities, Internet, western toilet, kitchen, sitting room {I think this is the living room}, maintenance), 9000 rmb monthly salary. I need to do; 18 teaching hours, 2 office hours, 1 English corner session a week, be a judge for the university English competition (extra pay for that). Classes are spread out so my day would be from 0800 to 1600 5 days a week, so this makes for a full time job as they prefer I don’t leave between classes. I have a feeling during the off hours is when they will try to get freebies out of me. The old “since you are here and are not doing anything” routine to try and pressure me into doing free lessons or tutoring or something else like that. Days off are Sunday and Monday so at least 2 off in a row. They do have a certificate to hire foreigners but I will need to send it to a friend I have made at the Chinese embassy in San Fransisco to be sure. It is written in simplified Chinese script that I can somewhat read but I would not know if it was real even if I could read it all. They will give me all the appropriate documentation that the consulate will need for me to get my work permit and Work visa prior to my leaving in October. They will take care of a residency permit once I am there. I did not know about any work permit before receiving this contract, can someone tell me what this is for? Sounds like another “get more money from the foreigner” thing. They will also take care of any issues that the local Government has when I get there. So now for the question, does this sound like a good offer? It has taken me a couple of weeks to negotiate it with them. I asked for the 5 day week and offered a 2nd English corner to get it but it looks like they just gave it to me without the extra English corner. There is no mention of “other duties as assigned” or anything that resembles that. I am happy with the deal but I am worried about a clause that says they can send me to another campus if there are no positions available at the Zhuhai campus. This clause does state that they can only temporarily assign me for no longer than 1 term and only twice during the contract. The wording just seems suspect to me. Oh and they will reimburse travel expenses.
Lee
Somewhere in newbies thread, I think it was...I posted a contract that was sent to me...look over that...
rob
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Lee,
seems legit as the schools who arent really in the teachers best interest
would not be doing what they have done so far or are going to do. looks
like they are a pretty good place to work as most are.
Ted
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You will be OK in Zhuhai. Living conditions there are probably the best in all of China. Completely new city - non of the old former fishing village remains.
Willy
I like that city also.clean and more slower life tempo than other big city.
It is a very good place for living. Now it seems more and more brothers settle down in Guandong.
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Update! So the teaching thing is still progressing along. The school has many different locations so I refused the relocation clause and agreed to do 3 hours each week of "English improvement sessions" with the other Chinese teachers. They have expressed an interest in having me teach 1 astronomy class each week instead of an English class. I am currently trying for more money for doing that class, as it takes more work and time to set up a lesson plan and activities.
I have received 3 calls from the Chinese consulate in San Francisco last week. They are very interested in my degree in Astrophysics. Could any one tell me why they are so interested in this? I feel like perhaps I have already made myself to visible to the Chinese government, and all I have done is negotiate with a State run university for a job teaching English. The consulate as far as I knew did not know I even had a degree. I just applied for a L-visa from them. The calls have been friendly. They just seem to be trying very hard to "sell" me on moving and staying in China. I find all of this very unsettling.It feels like a "set up" to me but I have been known to be a little paranoid at times. I have called and talked to my friend at the DOJ here in the states and he tells me that it is not surprising to him that the Chinese government once informed about an Astrophysicist already expressing a desire to move to China, would actively encourage them to do so. All I want to do is move to China marry my woman and live a happy simple life. My Lady thinks it is great. She is "very proud" of me. I find this very strange too, as I have done nothing for her to be "proud of", yet. I am certainly one confused person right now about all of this. I knew a bachelors degree in physics with a minor in Astrophysics was a high demand degree but jeesh I am just a small town country bumpkin. I only got the degree because I was interested in Astronomy and to understand that I needed to understand the math. By the time I got tired of taking math and astronomy classes I had the credits for the degree. I never intended on getting the degree nor ever using it once I found out that I could get it. Tried to get reassurance from my Lady but to be honest she is way out of her league on this particular subject so all she says is she is proud of me and "I know you will make the right decision". What the hell does that mean? For all my education I don't even understand the decision I am supposed to make here. So my brothers let me be a lesson for all of you; just because you are educated sure as hell does not make you smart. I think to my Lady the right decision is to move to China get a job that pays the highest possible amount and will gain the highest level of status as possible. I do not understand this type of thinking at all. It is very different to how I was raised. Then again I could be totally wrong on what she is thinking the "right" decision is. Since she is so ambiguous with her response to this subject I really have no idea of what she is thinking. :huh:
OK, I feel better just by venting some of my concerns a frustrations.
I guess this thread has started to turn into more of a journal of my experiences through this process. I certainly hope that someone other than me will get something useful out of this whole thing.
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Lee357,
If that's what your lady is thinking, then she is dead right!!!
Lee, ...Never sell yourself short in this world, no matter what, You have a commodity that these people want!!
So make sure you get them to pay as much as you can for that commodity you possess.
I don't know how you can't understand this, it's the way of the world, it's what makes the world tick.
It's called supply and demand!!! You have what they want!!! So anything that is going to make your life easier and more comfortable in China seize with both hands!! ...haha!!
David......
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Lee,
maybe they are looking at your degree as a possible job in the
helping of their relatively young space program that they are
developing. its a fascinating subject (space) as i have spent
years reading any and all information about the universe. i even
had my telescope at home and learned and taught some things to
my grandchildren. it was a wonderful time for us learning together
remember us little people if or when you get famous in China.
your lady is proud of you because you are taking the steps to
be with her which shows your commitment to her. a very important
thing with these Chinese ladies. they are looking for the genuine
commitment from the man which makes them proud of you when
you show that and take the steps. your doing more over and above
bby moving there and not just visiting and waiting. she feels very lucky
to have met you. my wife tells me that all the time how proud and lucky
she feels to have me here in China with her until the time she retires. she
knows and tells me i gave a lot up when i sold everything and came here
to live. VERY IMPORTANT for them
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Ted,
It's a subject that i've always been interested in also, The distances involved when talking about space and space travel is vast, so vast in fact the human brain just can't assimilate these distances.
It can't actually imagine or envisage a single ''light year'', let alone thousands of them...lol!!
Always fascinated me, that when your looking up at the stars, your not seeing them as they are now, but tens, hundreds,thousands and millions of years ago, depending on how many light years it's taken for the light from these stars to reach Earth!! ...Fascinating stuff ..hahaha!!!
David....
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Yes astronomy is a very big subject. It encompasses everything from things so small we can't measure them to things as large as the universe. I do particularly like the idea of distances so great that we measure them not in units of distance but in units of time. I think the coolest concept is that it makes no difference what direction you look you are always looking at the same point in time. To me that is just a awesome thing. I also like that no matter what planet you might be standing on if you looked up at the sky and used a telescope and measured how fast things are moving away from you. It would always seem to you that the planet, solar system, Galaxy, local cluster you are on and in is the center of the universe and every thing is always moving away from that point. Even though there is no "center" of the universe. Another cool tidbit, I think, about astrophysics is that once you learn how most of it works you can then figure out how to send a rocket (theoretically) from one planet to a completely different galaxy without ever running into anything. Now that is why I kept going to the classes, that one thought right there was just so cool to me.
I agree that She is proud of me because I am hers. I did not mean that I did not think that I should not achieve success in China, but I do not have the need to work While I am there. I have been fortunate in my life and have made some well timed investments that have turned out very well for me. I do not need to worry about money. What I am concerned about is having time to spend with my new love. I have been offered several high paying jobs as an astrophysicist here in the states and since it is not what I ever enjoyed doing I have always chosen to remain doing what I love to do, being an EMT/ firefighter. So, you can see I was brought up to not go after wealth and fame but to go after what I consider real success in life; happiness. I know that it is easy for me to say that and what I have just told you about my financial situation does not comply with my last statement. So it would be fair to say that I have not always lived up to those standards. In defence though the only career I have ever had is as an EMT/Firefighter.
This is not what I intended when I posted my last post anyways. I just needed to vent some paranoia and frustrations with the difference in culture between my soon to be wife and me. Also I am very paranoid about the government of China already knowing who I am.
In reality it does not matter, I am still going to move to China and what ever job I end up doing while there I will ensure that I have the time I think is needed for a new marriage to work. I would go all the way across time and space for this woman. I would even hold my breath to get there if I had to. :icon_cheesygrin:
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Alright! We have some other astronomers on here!! I am finding more and more to like about this forum. Any of you do any astro photography?
Dave C
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Lee keep us posted on the developments as they happen
interested in seeing were this plays out
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Lee keep us posted on the developments as they happen
interested in seeing were this plays out
I will I talked with my lady this morning and asked her what she meant by "I know you will make the right decision" She tells me that what ever decision I make will be the right one. So I ask her what would you want me to do. She replies with "I know that it is important to you, to have time to spend with me. I also know that I want to have time to spend with you. Life has been hard for me so I wish that you will understand me when I say, I would want you to earn a good living to take care of us." So I now know that she would want me to get a well paying job even if it takes time from us spending together. I am still going to teach because I think 9000 RMB a month plus the 3500 USD a month budgeted for living expenses will be more than enough for us to live very comfortably in China. I just don't want to work for the government. It may be my American arrogance and a little bit of national pride, I don't know but I just can't accept mentally working for a communist government. I hope that does not make me prejudice or a bad person. I may change my way of think on this after I live there for a couple of years but right now I just can't do it.
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I am glad you are all making good money and have excellent jobs. But perhaps you have to consider your lucky,
as after looking at a "jobs in china" site, most paid way under what your earning.
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lee,
my god 9000 rmb +3500 usd you will live like a king and queen here.
i make 8000 rmb a month for 10 hrs work a week and i have not touched
a dime of the money i have in the bank and Sisi and i live well of course her
small house is paid for so all i pay is water,power, maintenance fee,cable,
internet and we do well with what i make she even spends a little of what she makes
but not much. and with that i am still stashing away money for our travels later this year
if her boss gives her more than a week off at a time. so dont worry you two will do fine i
dont imagine you will even touch the USA dollars after the newness of living in China wears off
Some of that money will be used for visa for my lady, lots of traveling around China. I have many friends there. Traveling to other countries in the neighborhood. would like to spend a few weeks in Japan for example. Also hoping to buy a 50 to 52 foot sail boat while there and sail to different places. After I learn to sail. So need lessons. Also going to get at least a bachelors in Chinese studies while there. If I am there and want to learn about my ladies culture might as well get a degree while doing it. Might come in handy when the Chinese own the world. I think this is my plan but then again I am learning that if my plan does not exactly jive with my ladies plan, well.............then I guess we will go with her plan. Unless i think it is worth her telling me how she disagrees with me about it for a month. In a nice and polite way of course. if I don't use the money it will just sit there and build up. Mabe I will try my hand at investing in the Chinese stock market. Or invest it in some venture in China. I can garuntee I will think of some use for the money considering how much U.S taxes I will paying on it if it just sits in a personal account in the U.S.
I am glad you are all making good money and have excellent jobs. But perhaps you have to consider your lucky,
as after looking at a "jobs in china" site, most paid way under what your earning.
I understand that I very lucky. Nothing I have done so far in life has been totally on my own effort. I have been fortunate to have friends point me in the correct direction and opportunities just fall into my lap. Family that has given me good advise that I have followed. So yes I am very lucky. The pay for the job teaching in China is for a state University and those do pay considerably higher than any of the other teaching jobs. Also I have the credentials to meet the Chinese governments requirements, and with the advise of the brothers on this forum I have been able to negotiate from a position of knowledge instead of not knowing the right questions to ask and therefore the correct statements to say. So even in that yes I am lucky. I thank you for knocking me down a peg. I do apologize if I was sounding arrogant. I surely did not mean to. :angel:
Alright! We have some other astronomers on here!! I am finding more and more to like about this forum. Any of you do any astro photography?
Dave C
I am sorry I have not gotten into taking the pictures but I sure do love them when they are taken. I have seen the big telescopes that take the real detailed photos of the night sky, but I have never taken any photos with them as it takes hours of looking at the same point in the sky to get high resolution photos of say the crab nebula, or the pillers of creation. I did spend a wonderful night with my daughter taking pictures of the last lunar eclipse. I will post one of those pictures.
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Lee,
the pic is to dark hahahaha sorry couldnt resist that ok i will go to the corner again
Rocky,
your right the majority of jobs are low pay here which is why tutoring is a good way to go
you charge 200 rmb an hour 10 hours a week bingo 8000 rmb a month. Or if you have a great
degree then you can go Lee's way. Some schools he will find out pay upwards to 16,000 rmb a
month but you usually need a contact for those. I prefer not to go that route as i worked to hard
and to long in the USA all those years with the oil companies traveling and what not and i prefer to
have the freedom that i have now. If my wife didnt work then i wouldnt even be doing this. lol
but i will say i am enjoying it more and more because the kids love you here when you teach them
its not like in the states. hell in calif the school districts have their own armed police force on campus
thats not good anyway if you decide to move here then i will help you get your feet on the ground
Ted
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Update. I signed the revised teaching Contract. Biggest changes are No English corners at all. Only 5 teaching hours of English 4 teaching hours of Astrophysics. I will be working on government projects but no "sensitive involvement" (think that means state secrets stuff) 2 office hours and a five day work week Tuesday thru Saturday. Hours I am required to be at the school is from 0730 to 1630. So it will be a 9 hour day. Lower teaching hours for more Lab time. Housing is now an allowance instead of provided. From what you all have said I can get a very nice apartment in the city for what the allowance is. Airfare, Visa, residency card will be provided. Airfare is once to get there and once to go home and 2 round trip tickets to where ever I want to go in China for my 3 week vacation each year. One year contract with 1 year automatic extension in perpetuity if the University or I don't opt out with 6% pay raise for the first 5 years, then caped at 1% per year. Year end bonus of 15% after completing full contract year. Airfare reimbursement if an Emergency calls me home but only return ticket back to Zhuhai. "Automatic" Visa renewal when time comes as long as I continue to keep my passport current in the U.S. Round trip airfare for my daughter to come visit once every 2 years. The contract is not with the school though. The contract is with the government so not too sure what to think about it. I faxed it to my State senator and asked him to check into it for me, his secretary politely called me back and said the senator would look into it for me but is very busy right now and will likely not be able to get back to me until after the summer break. So I figured what the hell Ill sign it. My attorney looked at it and said he could not see anything that jumped out at him but then again he knows nothing about Chinese contract law. I think that this is as good of a deal as I am going to get. So that episode in my ongoing China experience is done. Now I can't wait to see what is next. I told my lady about it and I think she is pleased. I actually think if she could have she would have climbed through the phone and gave me a kiss and a hug. This will be very different from what I have ever done before. I am a little nervous about changing so much of my life. I am only 38 and this is a lot of change for me. I will be moving to a new country that is totally different then my own. I will be changing careers from the only one I have ever had, to something I have never done before. I will be getting married to a woman that although I love very much, I still don't understand how she thinks about things most of the time. I will be working for a foreign government, I don't even trust my own government much less one that I have been brought up to think of as the enemy. I am more referring to the Communist system not so much the Chinese government specifically. I think I am "freaking out". Time to go do some meditation and drink some tea and calm down a little I think. On top of all of this my Lady has to go out of town for 2 weeks for training on what the recent changes enacted by the government means to her profession. She is in real estate. She will not be able to talk to me very much over the next 2 weeks. We have talked in some form or another every day since December so this will be hard for me. Reading this post I sound like a whining little baby. OK enough of that. moving on. :icon_cool:
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Lee,
residence card or papers is extremely easy to get just go to the local police
were your at in China and fill out the papers. but if i were you MAKE sure you get
your work visa before you LEAVE the USA. there is no work visa's issued in China or
in Hong Kong under any option so if they say that its not true. this is fact and not some
hype one might read on the net. If you are lead to believe they can and will get it when you
arrive it will be just a sorry we cant obtain it. then you are working illegal and subject to
removal. if you just quit after that then whatever money owed you will not be payed. the
reason will be you didnt fulfill your obligation of the contract.
LEE,
the college is sponsored by the gov't but in actuality you are not working for the gov't a
gov't sponsored college enjoys the benefits of getting money from the gov't to help with
their day to day operations. it also enables them to charge a higher tuition fee to the students.
so it cannot and will not get you a work visa after you get to China so just make sure that paper
work is forwarded to you before you leave the states. just a little heads up on this as i would hate
to see you get here and the bottom falls out. not having a visa is why you see a lot of teachers spending short times at
schools teaching and moving on to other schools. i have met to many of them at the consulate trying to get
their wives to go home with them only to be told that the visa paper work needs to be completed at
and gone thru the process like everyone else. so they end up going home without thier wives and
and not being able to get back with another visa for visit because the govt denies you a re-entry visa
because you didnt play by the rules. or going home because they cant work here and have no money to live here
Ted
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Lee,
residence card or papers is extremely easy to get just go to the local police
were your at in China and fill out the papers. but if i were you MAKE sure you get
your work visa before you LEAVE the USA. there is no work visa's issued in China or
in Hong Kong under any option so if they say that its not true. this is fact and not some
hype one might read on the net. If you are lead to believe they can and will get it when you
arrive it will be just a sorry we cant obtain it. then you are working illegal and subject to
removal. if you just quit after that then whatever money owed you will not be payed. the
reason will be you didnt fulfill your obligation of the contract.
LEE,
the college is sponsored by the gov't but in actuality you are not working for the gov't a
gov't sponsored college enjoys the benefits of getting money from the gov't to help with
their day to day operations. it also enables them to charge a higher tuition fee to the students.
so it cannot and will not get you a work visa after you get to China so just make sure that paper
work is forwarded to you before you leave the states. just a little heads up on this as i would hate
to see you get here and the bottom falls out. not having a visa is why you see a lot of teachers spending short times at
schools teaching and moving on to other schools. i have met to many of them at the consulate trying to get
their wives to go home with them only to be told that the visa paper work needs to be completed at
and gone thru the process like everyone else. so they end up going home without thier wives and
and not being able to get back with another visa for visit because the govt denies you a re-entry visa
because you didnt play by the rules. or going home because they cant work here and have no money to live here
Ted
Thank you Ted that really takes a lot off my mind. Yes you had already told me or I had already read about getting the work visa prior to leaving the U.S and as soon as the contract is delivered in the mail to Beijing and approved by the Government contract office or what ever department deals with such things in China I can go to the consulates office in San Francisco with my visa and they will issue me a work visa and something they call a Foreign Expert certificate. No paper work needed. Like I said I am not going to be under contract to the School I am under contract to the Government of China. Working at the School. My paycheck will be issued By the Peoples Republic Of China not the School. When my work for the Government requires that I be away from the school I will not be under any obligation to fulfill my teaching duties during that time. I refused to move to Beijing and the government was keen enough to get a American trained Astrophysicist that they decided that I could work out of the University doing research projects for the government, in the hopes that once I get there and I get married I will change my mind and eventually agree to move where they want me to. I went with the option that my Lady wanted me to go with. Sorry I was not clearer in my post. I opted to go to work for the Government instead, much better pay and benefits. Also according to my Lady more prestige, I don't care about that but she sure does and I can understand it, she comes from a poor family. It took me a little while to understand or better put come to terms with just how important status is in China to people from the poor country regions. Class status seems to dictate what kind of job and life one can have in China still. By the way my Lady is what they call a migrant worker in Zhuhai. She was not born there and only came there to find work to help support her family and mainly according to her not to be a burden on her parents. I never noticed this when I was a tourist but I never payed any attention to Class structure either, too wrapped up in my own fun time I guess. So since it is no skin off my teeth either way I chose to take the job she had hoped I would, for her. I am absolutely sure she would have been happy even if I chose to take the job directly for the School instead and would have still been proud to marry me. If I do not get my work visa I will still go and marry my Lady in October with my current L-visa and not work. I do believe that the Chinese government is interested enough to get things done just like a woman from China when she likes you will almost move heaven and earth just to be able to be with you. I am rapidly learning through my Lady that one should never underestimate the Chinese. I am also learning that the image they chose to project at times of being slow and not in a hurry is not at all true just a ploy to gain a little time or put off something so they can think about it or try and figure out if they can get a better deal if dealing in business.
Ted,
I would also like to thank you for your obvious kindness and caring by offering me so much advice and trying very hard to help me stay out of trouble by sharing your knowledge with me.
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Lee,
Your observations on the Chinese, (be it men or women) is very astute of you!! No they certainly aren't slow, once they know what they want. Only a fool and his dog underestimates the way the Chinese mind works.
If only there business mind, wasn't so dammed greedy, .....They would have it all!!!
Best of luck on your new life venture in China, hope everything goes exactly as you want it to go... It probably won't, but enough will, more than enough to make this turning point in you life a very worth while adventure for you both!! lol!!!
David....
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Lee,
Your observations on the Chinese, (be it men or women) is very astute of you!! No they certainly aren't slow, once they know what they want. Only a fool and his dog underestimates the way the Chinese mind works.
If only there business mind, wasn't so dammed greedy, .....They would have it all!!!
Best of luck on your new life venture in China, hope everything goes exactly as you want it to go... It probably won't, but enough will, more than enough to make this turning point in you life a very worth while adventure for you both!! lol!!!
David....
I agree that they do get to damn greedy at times and it cost them a lot. On the other hand there is something to be said for there is a sucker born every day and the kind of volume style of business they usually conduct will catch those suckers enough that they will someday soon have it all. Hell you can't buy anything that is not made in China. At least at some point in its manufacturing or components.
I hope that it turns out just like I hope for but like my dad always said roll with the punches then punch back. All I hope will turn out exactly like I want it too is my new life with my Lady. the rest of all of this is just translator fluff as far as I am concerned.
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Lee,
as far as everything not going as planned when living in China i have a few words on that:
when you first arrive it is a new,fun exciting time and after a short while it becomes frustrating
at times because as you know everything is different. language,signs,crowds,customs. but i will
say that after the local people see that your not a foriegner visiting but actually living here things
change. and believe me they do change. as they see you again and again they then go out of their
way to meet and talk with you. you start to make casual freinds and close freinds. and they try and
help you,teach you,advise you, and learn from you. and you will find that it is a really nice place to
live and work in. as far as business dealings, they are shrewd just like in any other country with the
exception it is all out in the open no hidden surprises. enjoy your life here with your wife and her family.
you will not regret it and if many other guys new what i know and Willy knows then the hesitation or
resistance to live here would be non existant. look me up when you and your wife have the time for
socializing and Sisi and i would love to meet the two of you. and if grandpa (willy) could get away he
and Angel i am sure would join also.
Ted
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Wedding update.
So my Lady tells me the plans are done and the whole process should only take 3 days. I have no idea how long a wedding in China can take but she says she kept it short for me. The days should be over before 6 pm each day and will not start before 8 am. I only complained once that 6:30 in the morning was too early for me. :fi_lone_ranger: She even booked a honey moon and will not tell me where or what it is. She will only say "it is my surprise" then she giggles for five minutes about it. total price for wedding, honey moon, first three months rent on the apartment she has rented for us to live in (western bathroom), Marriage fee, all appropriate red envelopes, gift for parents, clothing, transportation to and from wedding and honeymoon of 6000 USD. Not to bad I think. I sent her 6000 just for the apartment. I did not know that most apartments come fully furnished. I expected to have to buy furniture and a TV. She has money left over since I have sent her a total of I think 8000 USD total since we decided to get married. Her father called me this morning to tell me that her mother was going to call tomorrow and had some questions for me. He read off the list of questions she has for me. He just thought I should be prepared and have well thought out answers for her. Apparently she seems to think I am very smart and would be able to give in depth answers right away. One of the questions is if I have already slept with her daughter. WOW what a question to be asked. I am pretty sure there are very few mother in laws in America that would ask such a thing. I am sure there are a few but I have never heard of it. I guess this is my final interview before the invitations go out. Another one of the questions is how often my lady will get to come home to visit. Mom is under the impression we will be moving back to the states shortly after marriage. I think she knows that eventually we will move back. Another question she has for me is about money and how much we will be able to send home after mom and dad retire. Dad works for a company that has dealings in the states and knew that this question would concern me so he spent a lot of time explaining to me the cultural reasons behind why his wife would ask about such a thing of me. The other two questions are personal and I will not air them here. So that is my update for you all. Good luck, this is so much fun so far.
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I was going to suggest you not tell her that you've slept with her daughter, but you seem to have things sewn up tight, I'm sure you have a perfect answer for her. I'd be interested to know what it is in case I ever get asked that question though. :blush:
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I was going to suggest you not tell her that you've slept with her daughter, but you seem to have things sewn up tight, I'm sure you have a perfect answer for her. I'd be interested to know what it is in case I ever get asked that question though. :blush:
just hung up with mom. She says I am acceptable. My answer to her question was simple. I have not slept with your daughter, I love her and my new family too much to dishonor either of them. So it turned out well.
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well Lee it looks as though everything is set and on course
congrats on everything and dont forget to keep in touch
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well Lee it looks as though everything is set and on course
congrats on everything and dont forget to keep in touch
Thank you and from time to time I will drop an update on this thread. kind of let every body know what this journey has been like for me. Not sure if it will do anyone else any good but what the heck can't hurt either. :icon_cool:
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Lee357,
If you sleep with the woman you ''Love'' ....your dishonouring them??? Sorry, i don't see the logic in that statement!!!
It always takes 'two' to tango, ...(unless of course one is forced to tango) It's a bit different if you slept with a woman promising marriage and then disappear without trace, but that isn't the case here...lol!!!
David....
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Lee357,
If you sleep with the woman you ''Love'' ....your dishonouring them??? Sorry, i don't see the logic in that statement!!!
It always takes 'two' to tango, ...(unless of course one is forced to tango) It's a bit different if you slept with a woman promising marriage and then disappear without trace, but that isn't the case here...lol!!!
David....
The answer I gave was a respectable answer considering I was talking to her mother. Besides what my lady and I did or did not do is not anyone's concern but our own. Especially her mothers. Her mothers concern was Sex before marriage as that is very important to her mother.
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Lee,
i agree with what you told the mom
EXTREMELY RESPECTABLE ANSWER
as i am sure you know sex before marriage in China
is considered unrespectable and does dishonor the
ladies in the eyes of the elders. so i think that you
did very well in moms eyes.
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update I surprised her with a Engagement ring. I had it sent from the States to her at her apartment. I arranged delivery during the time we usually chat on QQ so I could get some snap shots of her face. I tried to take a snap shot when she came back to the computer after the delivery came to her house but any way here she is right after or shortly after that. you know sometimes QQ video can be a little jumpy. Enjoy the pics of my most loved Lady.
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Update!!
Very exciting for me. I arranged for an engagement ring to be delivered to my ladies apartment today during our scheduled QQ chat time. So I got a couple of pics to share with you guys of right after she got it. Well one is right after she got back to the computer (second pic) after answering the door and the other is shortly after that. So I hope you enjoy the pics as much as I did getting them. By the way yes she gave me permission to post them here.
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Lee,
I quite agree, it should have nothing to do with anyone, including, and especially her Mum!! Just saying No, is also a respectable answer...lol!!!
Basically, i was just having a bit of fun with you, Turning the dishonour thing around to mean the complete opposite. lol!!...
Ted,
I think your talking about how it was 20+ years ago. I'm sure there are some that still hold that view, but from my experience in China, those days are long gone... China has visibly changed out of all recognition in all manner things and thinking, ... even from when i first arrived in China. Just think about it, 20 years ago and Beijing was like a ghost town after midnight!!! ....Now it's a living breathing dynamic City, that buzzes and pulses 24 hours a day...
David.....
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So my lady has started to do something I did not expect. We spend hours on QQ web cam each day. Over the last few days she has not wanted to turn off the web cam. She watches me sleep and leaves her web cam on all night so I can watch her sleep. We both have very busy lives but from about 12:00pm my time until I leave for my day at about 8:00 am she just sits in her apartment and watches me sleep and is always there when I wake up. In turn I am sure to be there when she wakes up at 7:00 am her time each day to say good morning to her. and we chat until each of us has to leave to go do things. As the weeks go by since my last visit she has been more insistent on my taking my lap top with me when I go anyplace inside of my house. Yes even into the bathroom. When I clean the kitchen she wants to watch me do it. When I cook my dinner she wants to be there. I think she is using the web cam to be a part of my life. She also has a lap top so she takes it with her to anyplace she can reach with the cord still plugged into the wall. I have seen her cook and clean. Even Use the squat toilet. If she or I am at home we are seeing each other on web cam. I do not mind this, actually it is very reassuring to me in a very strange way. I am not used to living my life in front of a camera. I kinda feel like the U.S reality game show contestants. As I am writing this she is on her day off from work and is taking a nap. I keep looking in on her so that I will be there when she opens her eyes. Do any of your ladies wanted this much web cam time with you. I am finally getting used to taking my computer with me every where in my house. We have even watched movies together in this way. Yesterday we watched her favorite movie and today we watched Avatar in my living room. We set our computers up so that we can see each other and the TV then we watch the movie together. We do not need to type to each other since we have a common Language. it would not take to much positioning so we could if we wanted to.
Well that is what is new with me. she is waking up now so I will go.
By the way I now know exactly what all you married guys were talking about whe you said your ladies got very grouchy when they were hungry. My lady is night and day when she is full or hungry. My god can she eat. She eats the largest bowl of noodle I have ever seen for dinner every night. She snacks all the time between meals. I can always tell when she is hungry. She starts to get short with her communication. Also It has teken me a little while to fiqure this out, but I now know she lives in a single room above where she works. I thought it was a little strange she never wanted to show me her apartment when I came to visit her.
oh I forpot to mention that she loves to sing to me. She is singing to me right now while she cooks her food.
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that seems to be very interesting although im not sure of the bathroom web cam
but i would say it very much shows the committment on your part and hers to the
relationship. when i was in the USA Sisi and i web cammed 3 hours in the morning
and 3 hours when she came home. i know it made her tired with her work but i was
very happy for the time we spent as we covered and planned many things for my arrival
in Sept. And my wife eats like a horse as they say and i still havent figured out were
she puts it. maybe the old saying ;hollow legs;
yes china has changed over the last 20 years dramatically but i still say that chinese ladies
have far more self respect in a larger percentage than women from the west in regards to
certain premarital things. ive been coming here for just going on 9 years this year ad it has
changed a lot just during this time.
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Ted,
What i will say, ...is that the Chinese ladies are nowhere near as blatant as the Western woman, nothing is blatant or flaunted or made in public.
Behind closed doors Ted, then that is another matter completly. Any women you generally meet in China will not give you any reason to think anything other, than what you have just posted. But if you were there partner, fiancee, boyfriend, you would find a completly different lady...
As i said Ted, ....Behind closed doors!!
David....
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David,
yes thats what i meant to say or tried to say. you need to be in
some sort of commitment with them, the casual thing is almost a
non existent thing in China or very few and far apart
which is part of the reason i was attracted to here
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My wife is somewhat traditional. we did not sleep together until we were engaged. When i went there to get married, we lived together for about a month. I asked her what her family thought of that and she said they were all fine with it, even Mama. She was married before and she is 42 years old but still. Before we were engaged when we traveled we had separate rooms.
I thought my wife and I talked enough with twice a day. i cant imagine 8 hours of web cam. You must leave the lights on in order for her to watch you sleep. The bathroom thing i can sort of understand. They do not have any kind of hang up about their bodily functions. i am sort of a private person when it comes to that so it bothered me at first, but i got used to it. Just like under arm hair. She only shaves in the summer. It bothered me at first, but I got used to it. I told her she will have to learn to shave all the time here or else she will be made fun of. Qingqing shaves all of the time as most younger women do that I know.
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Funny talking about webcam
Myself and Sophie spoke everyday for about 8 hours...I could see her in her nightime for about 2 hours., and always let her see me right through my nightime....She wanted to see me sleep the other night...Womdered why?
Will miss this...:@
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Funny talking about webcam
Myself and Sophie spoke everyday for about 8 hours...I could see her in her nightime for about 2 hours., and always let her see me right through my nightime....She wanted to see me sleep the other night...Womdered why?
Will miss this...:@
I finally asked my lady why she wanted to spend so much time on Web-cam. she told me that if I could not be there and she could not be with me here. we would make a temporary home in the Internet. we have not shut off the Web-cam in over 2 weeks now. we even leave it on even if neither of us are home. it has kinda become similar to coming home before she is home and being home alone until she arrives. almost like real life. in a strange way. but then again how strange in reality is it for us to be trying to build a love from thousands of miles away. I am beginning to believe that the term strange is a relative word.:icon_biggrin:
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That's right Lee . Let other People think of it as strange instead of you . Let them think of you as crazy , but ... who will look better at the end ? Isn't it alway's ... who has the last laugh wins ?:icon_cheesygrin:
To think , I never even used a Webcam on my Venture . Just started out on this whole Computer business and wouldn't have known how to use it anyway . But , now I do and I have no use for if . Hahaha
But my Wife of course does , every weekend to see her Family and talk .
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Lee it is a wonderful thing your doing and who cares what people think.
just two people in love who cant be together but want to share everything
while apart. even when the other isnt there the other can wait and anticipate
the other ones arrival.
Arnolds web cam must have been pics thru snail mail lol!!!!!
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That's right Lee . Let other People think of it as strange instead of you . Let them think of you as crazy , but ... who will look better at the end ? Isn't it alway's ... who has the last laugh wins ?:icon_cheesygrin:
To think , I never even used a Webcam on my Venture . Just started out on this whole Computer business and wouldn't have known how to use it anyway . But , now I do and I have no use for if . Hahaha
But my Wife of course does , every weekend to see her Family and talk .
Lee it is a wonderful thing your doing and who cares what people think.
just two people in love who cant be together but want to share everything
while apart. even when the other isnt there the other can wait and anticipate
the other ones arrival.
Arnolds web cam must have been pics thru snail mail lol!!!!!
Thank you Guys. Actually you guys on this forum are the only ones that know about this. I have not thought it was anybodies business. I post it here because if anyone could understand it would be all of us nuts.
What I want to know is are we peanuts or walnuts? hahaha. :icon_cheesygrin:
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Me and Willy are just .....NUTS...:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
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You ever notice how the Lady is never wrong. No matter what she says, it is always us or at least me, that has misunderstood her meaning behind what was said. I think that is part of the reason they like western men. We can admit when we are wrong. Makes them always being right so much easier. I do not know, just a thought that just occurred to me. As I sit here trying to figure out why she has gotten so upset with me again. Might also be because she has not eaten breakfast yet too. Huh, either way, she will be done being angry in about twenty minutes. Then she will explain to me how I was so wrong this time. :huh:
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You ever notice how the Lady is never wrong. No matter what she says, it is always us or at least me, that has misunderstood her meaning behind what was said. I think that is part of the reason they like western men. We can admit when we are wrong. Makes them always being right so much easier. I do not know, just a thought that just occurred to me. As I sit here trying to figure out why she has gotten so upset with me again. Might also be because she has not eaten breakfast yet too. Huh, either way, she will be done being angry in about twenty minutes. Then she will explain to me how I was so wrong this time. :huh:
To be honest, I can't relate to that one. Although we have some misunderstandings, and it is usually my fault, we have hit some big issues that were totally her fault. And one of the things I love about her, is that she owns up to something if she is wrong. We hit two major issues, where she had to own up to being wrong. One particular issue ended up involving the entire family. I had a hard time accepting that the entire family (Mom, Dad, Brother, His Wife, Cousins, Aunts, Uncles) were all in on it.
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Arnolds web cam must have been pics thru snail mail lol!!!!!
Or like from the flintstone era....:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
Sorry arnold, couldn't resist...:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
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Lee,
if nothing happens here in about 2 to 3 weeks i will have a terrific way
for her to meet a pretty good man. this option is going to be a very exclusive type
option for ladies looking for not the run of the mill average never know what you will
find type of guys. i will let you know or you can check with me also
Ted
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Which province is she living in Lee?
Willy
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you must have gave her a really great impression of americans which
is why she prefers them. but of course i hope she keeps her options
open to any were or anyone as long as they are good people
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It has been a little while since I last posted an update. So here it is: My lady and I are still together, still getting married, still spending every day most all day on web cam. In my opinion life could only be better if I was already in China with her. I am leaving for China on June 11 and am going to spend only a week with her. It will be entirely too short of a visit but it is all the time I have to go. I attempted to send some gifts to her and had the unfortunate luck of my package being inspected by the Chinese customs officer. I received a polite letter and my package back from them. Apparently I did not fill out the customs label properly, and sent some items that are not allowed. I would tell you what those items are, but they did not tell me what they were. This is the first time this has happened out of five different times i have sent packages to her. Luck of the draw I think. I will try again. At least my lady trust that i actually sent them and did not require proof, I emailed the letter to her anyways. We ran into a snag that seemed very large at first but turned into a very expensive, but easy fix. She is the first born child out of two. Mom and dad did not register her so they could try to have a boy. So she did not have a birth certificate or the Chinese version of it. Was very expensive to get it fixed. Not a difficult task after she found the correct person, but I had to pay several people for her to get to the one I needed to pay. I bring this up only as a cautionary tale. If you are dating the first born that was born after the one child law. You may want to find out if she has a birth certificate. I will also say do not push about it. It is a very embarrassing subject for the Lady. To her it will most likely feel like she is at fault for the issue and not want to tell you. From fear you will not want her anymore. These ladies are very aware that there are many other Chinese girls wanting our attention. To them anything that they think would make them less desirable to us is something to be hidden.
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It has been a little while since I last posted an update. So here it is: My lady and I are still together, still getting married, still spending every day most all day on web cam. In my opinion life could only be better if I was already in China with her. I am leaving for China on June 11 and am going to spend only a week with her. It will be entirely too short of a visit but it is all the time I have to go. I attempted to send some gifts to her and had the unfortunate luck of my package being inspected by the Chinese customs officer. I received a polite letter and my package back from them. Apparently I did not fill out the customs label properly, and sent some items that are not allowed. I would tell you what those items are, but they did not tell me what they were. This is the first time this has happened out of five different times i have sent packages to her. Luck of the draw I think. I will try again. At least my lady trust that i actually sent them and did not require proof, I emailed the letter to her anyways. We ran into a snag that seemed very large at first but turned into a very expensive, but easy fix. She is the first born child out of two. Mom and dad did not register her so they could try to have a boy. So she did not have a birth certificate or the Chinese version of it. Was very expensive to get it fixed. Not a difficult task after she found the correct person, but I had to pay several people for her to get to the one I needed to pay. I bring this up only as a cautionary tale. If you are dating the first born that was born after the one child law. You may want to find out if she has a birth certificate. I will also say do not push about it. It is a very embarrassing subject for the Lady. To her it will most likely feel like she is at fault for the issue and not want to tell you. From fear you will not want her anymore. These ladies are very aware that there are many other Chinese girls wanting our attention. To them anything that they think would make them less desirable to us is something to be hidden.
that is quite a frequent thing were the one who isnt registered misses out on the schooling and other things from what i understand
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Very interesting Lee , thanks for telling us . That will be very helpful to some I'm sure .
Ted , I see you made it here .. but NO picture ? Having to look for the right shirt first ?
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Lee,
Good point, ....and yes it was quite common, especially just after the single child rule came in to force.
I have heard of a few ladies needing to sort this problem out, and for the same reason, but have not heard of it being expensive as such, but more along the lines of time consuming if your trying to do it yourself ....
So what are you calling expensive then Lee?? Expensive in our terms, or their terms?? Did you hire a fixer to get the paperwork sorted out, or just someone who to knew who to bibe?? haha!!!
David....
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Lee, what is the age of your lady? Since Xiuru and I are both 56, she also did not have a birth cirtificate. All she had to do was go to the local notory. She filled out a simple form, stating her birth date, the names of her mother and father, and place of birth. Two days later she had what is called the Notorial Birth Certificate. No cost. This along with her National Registery Card, and Passport, were all that was needed for the K-1 visa process. Just an update here. I sent the K-1 visa request to the homeland secruity office on February 1, 2010. May 1 we got approval. Then went to the State Department's National Visa Center. Was processed and sent to China on May 8th. I leave Monday for Shenyang. Xiuru has all the papework necessary for the interview. We are now just waiting for the Embassy to send us the date.
buzz
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just a test for me to see if it posts
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Lee,
Good point, ....and yes it was quite common, especially just after the single child rule came in to force.
I have heard of a few ladies needing to sort this problem out, and for the same reason, but have not heard of it being expensive as such, but more along the lines of time consuming if your trying to do it yourself ....
So what are you calling expensive then Lee?? Expensive in our terms, or their terms?? Did you hire a fixer to get the paperwork sorted out, or just someone who to knew who to bibe?? haha!!!
David....
It was easy to fix. The expensive part was I left it up to her to fix. She did not know where to go or who to talk to. so she started with people she new in the local government. At each person she talked to it took some kind of money to get the name of another person. I think since she is a migrant worker and trying to find out how to fix the problem in a different city than her birth city she was taken advantage of. I would have came here to ask but the site was down. So she found out and fixed it. My cost in total was $500. expensive considering for $25 filling fee she could have fixed it. like I said easy fix that was very expensive. I talked of it so others would not have to do what I did. Might I add she was scared to death she or even her parents would be fined and even maybe put in jail. This is a real fear for her. It has kept her from every trying to fix this. Another thing I think I have learned is to try to keep your lady from telling anybody she is trying to deal with over things like this, that she is doing this so she can marry a foreigner. I do believe immediate dollar signs roll in their eyes and the cost of everything at least doubles.
Long story short, yes it was expensive bribing people to find the right person to pay.
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Lee, what is the age of your lady? Since Xiuru and I are both 56, she also did not have a birth cirtificate. All she had to do was go to the local notory. She filled out a simple form, stating her birth date, the names of her mother and father, and place of birth. Two days later she had what is called the Notorial Birth Certificate. No cost. This along with her National Registery Card, and Passport, were all that was needed for the K-1 visa process. Just an update here. I sent the K-1 visa request to the homeland secruity office on February 1, 2010. May 1 we got approval. Then went to the State Department's National Visa Center. Was processed and sent to China on May 8th. I leave Monday for Shenyang. Xiuru has all the papework necessary for the interview. We are now just waiting for the Embassy to send us the date.
buzz
Buzz,
The one child policy started in 1979 so your Lady was not born and then illegally not registered. my Lady was born in 1982 so she was born in the beginning of the policy. So her and her parents fear of the fact they violated the law is very ingrained and real. They have good reason to fear law enforcement finding out. The fines can be very steep and the fact is they never know how their social status is going to affect the justice they receive. My lady comes from a very poor farming family. She is now a migrant worker, and on top of all of that she is a minority in China. She is from Tibet. all of this stacks against her when dealing with the government at the local level especially since she is trying to do it from a city that is not her birth city.
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The one child policy started in 1979 so your Lady was not born and then illegally not registered. my Lady was born in 1982 so she was born in the beginning of the policy. So her and her parents fear of the fact they violated the law is very ingrained and real. They have good reason to fear law enforcement finding out. The fines can be very steep and the fact is they never know how their social status is going to affect the justice they receive. My lady comes from a very poor farming family. She is now a migrant worker, and on top of all of that she is a minority in China. She is from Tibet. all of this stacks against her when dealing with the government at the local level especially since she is trying to do it from a city that is not her birth city.
My wife said that farmers / village residents are allowed to have two children. Her uncle is an example. Maybe it's the same in Tibet ??? My in-laws then paid a penalty when they had their third child [ 1984 ].
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The truth of the matter is I do not know if farmers are allowed more than one or not. I do know that my lady and her family seem to think they were not allowed more than one. So her birth was never registered. she has never been to school and she has worked in the city since she was 15 as a migrant worker. I do know she is one of the Chinese people that have slipped through the cracks of their society. She seems to think it is her lot in life and is very happy with her life as it is. So I do not input my personal beliefs on the matter. I only brought it up so others might not get the shock of not being told until 5 months before the wedding that she can not get married because of this issue. It took me weeks to convince her to try and find a solution. she did not believe that it could be fixed. She was scared to death I would leave her, she was terrified once the government knew about it she would be thrown in jail or fined very heavily. She was even more scared that her parents would get into trouble over the whole thing. To tell the truth I was a little surprised at her not thinking this could be solved. She has been very self assured ever since my visit and has totally managed the whole wedding plans, living arrangements, banking arrangements for me. She seemed to be able to handle everything in life. It was a very good lesson on just how fragile these ladies can be.
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The one child policy started in 1979 so your Lady was not born and then illegally not registered. my Lady was born in 1982 so she was born in the beginning of the policy. So her and her parents fear of the fact they violated the law is very ingrained and real. They have good reason to fear law enforcement finding out. The fines can be very steep and the fact is they never know how their social status is going to affect the justice they receive. My lady comes from a very poor farming family. She is now a migrant worker, and on top of all of that she is a minority in China. She is from Tibet. all of this stacks against her when dealing with the government at the local level especially since she is trying to do it from a city that is not her birth city.
My wife said that farmers / village residents are allowed to have two children. Her uncle is an example. Maybe it's the same in Tibet ??? My in-laws then paid a penalty when they had their third child [ 1984 ].
Many minorities and rural families now have the one child policy relaxed. It is a fairly recent change in Chinese policy, and one due to increase social stability among minorities, and of course the rural poor.
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In all honesty, the point i wanted to convey was to breach this subject very tenderly with your lady. Try to do it earlier rather than later. I did not find out about this problem until after I had already sent money for the wedding, spent money on two trips and have sent money for support to my Lady. If she had insisted on not trying to fix this problem I would have been out real money. I know that is not the primary concern. money is not everything, but if you are like me it is a very big one as money does not grow on trees. If your lady is in the same position mine was. She will be very scared not only to tell you but also of what the government will do to her and more importantly to her parents. She will give up a love that she desperately wants to (in her mind) protect her parents. I can guarantee that most of these ladies will allow it to end with you before she puts her family in trouble with the central government. This can happen without you ever knowing what happened. It is something that I had not even thought about. I was totally unprepared to discuss it nor did I have any knowledge of how to fix it. My lady totally relied on me for courage and for advise on how to fix the problem. I was lucky in that I had built a trust with her. Otherwise by her own admission she was going to just quit on us and start an argument then break it off with me. She instead went against her first nature and discussed such a big problem with me. This is at its core a family problem to them. Unless you are considered part of the family it will be against their nature to even discuss it with you. It could be a very bad situation that you will not have any control over much less even know that it is happening.
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its always been allowed that people from the countryside can have 2 children
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update. on may 26 at 2:34 pm beijing time. My dearest love was killed in a car accident. I thank you all for your support. and kindness. I will not be on for a while. as you pobably can tell I do not want to talk about nor do I want to think about this. I found out today from her mother. about ten minutes ago. I really do not even know why I came on here to talk about this. probably because I do not know any one in my life that approved of my going to China to find a wife. I think also I can put it in words. and cry without anyone actually seeing me. or telling me it is going to be alright. right now it does not feel like it is going to be alright. I am sitting alone. I have never felt so alone as i do right now. I am numb. i can not think. i feel like some one has sucked all the air out of the room. This has got to be some cruel joke. well i am going now. and please do not tell me it will be alright. if i do come back in the next few weeks. i do not think i will feel like it is ever going to be alright. i feel like life has cheated me. i actually feel cheated. bye.
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Lee, I'm sure the whole membership here will pass their condonences to you.
But I know, words cannot take the pain away. Right now, you need time to takeit in and grieve. As mike said, 'our' prayers are with all connected. And we are here for you, if you need anyone.
What you have told us, will probably hit a nerve with those who are attached and have our ladies there.
So very sorry my friend.
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I am sorry. That's all I will say.
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Lee, hard to know what to say at a moment like this. You have my sincere condolences.
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Lee I'm sorry to hear this.
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Lee , may she become the most beautiful angel of all, we are so sad , Robert and Sujuan .
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are deepest condolences from Ted and Sara
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Im so sorry to read this. My deepest condolences to you.
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Lee,
There are not words right now that can bring you total comfort and rest with this loss. I know because I have been there before. Just know that we as community mourn with you in your loss and that our heart goes out to you. Please take the needed time to grieve this loss. It is important that you do that. Also pick a couple of men on this site and talk with them through PM. I say PM so that you can pour out what you are feeling and not worry about what the others might think.
What ever you do don't stay gone from this site. We're all here for you bro.
Shaun
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Lee,
Sorry for your loss.
Take Care.
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What can one say ? There is nothing Lee , that I can add either to make this comforting or hurt less ... but to also pray for you and the Lady you lost and her Family .
Qing and Myself also give you our Condolences !!!
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Really sorry to hear that Lee. I know there is nothing we can say that will help you feel better, but we are here if you need us.
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thank you. i leave for China today. it will not be the return i had hoped for. thank you to all the brothers here. it has been a very lonely time for me. my family act like i dodged a bullet. they do not say it, but it is obvious to me. my friends have reverted to drunken frat boys around me. they do not know what to say or do. I have gotten more than a few "well at least you only knew her for 6 months". like that makes this any less painful. I have even my mother tell my sister, "he will get over this quickly how much can he really be in love. He has only really met her twice." It has been hell. I am going to spend some time in China with her family. I do not think it will make it easier for me in the short run, but I think being with those who loved her as much as i did and actually understand my pain. Will help in the long run. I do not know. I am completely lost right now. I know i am feeling very alone, and my support system here does not understand. I know they try as best as they can, but they just can not understand and it shows. I know that her family welcomes me to come and grieve with them. Dad suggested it. I do not know if this is the correct path, but i know i must do something to be with people that are closer to my heart then those around me here. Good bye my friends. I will check in from time to time. Until my heart is right again, i might as well go where my heart has been since December and my future was going to be.
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Lee,
For what it is worth I think you are making the right decision to go and be with her family. You and her family will benefit in the long run. It will help to bring closure for all of you. I know it is painful but it's got to hurt before it can heal.
Don't stay away from this site. We all care about you and want to know how you are doing. So keep us informed and if there is anything within my reach that I can do let me know. PM me if you need to.
Shaun
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I have returned to the states. I will only be here for about 3 weeks. I will return to Chongqing and begin my new life there. It has been a rough month, but I have survived. I have tried a couple of times to log onto here in China but have not been able to. I am not a computer wiz so i could not figure out the proxy thing. Now for my new news. My Chinese family has been wonderful they have been very supportive and loving. they have welcomed me into the family with open arms. Just prior to me leaving to come back to the states dad called his other single daughter back home. He has been suggesting that i might like her as much as I did Shichao. I find this a little strange, but I have been out to dinner with her a few times. She is totaly different then Shichao was. I am not really interested in her and had to find a very diplomatic way to tell her and dad. It worked out well. Turns out she has a boy she likes and only came back because her dad wanted her to. I am going to post some pictures of Shichao in my album. they are of are wedding pictures. I have accepted her death. I am not ready to move on, but acceptance has given me a certain amount of peace. Mother has told me that when I am ready to meet another girl. This girl will have to gain their approval before I can marry her. To them I am now their son. I like that except upon accepting that honor I discovered that I now am responsible to them just like any Chinese son would be. One must accept the good with the bad. Dad has managed to get me permanent resident status. I do not know how he did it. So in short I may have lost my love, but i gained a family all the same. So I am a richer human being for the experience. I do not know if my reaction to this is typical or even normal. I do know that i have found a certain amount of happiness in China. I know that I am going to move back there to live the rest of my life. At least as long as the Chinese will let me stay. I have agreed to work for the government using my degree in Astrophysics on their small but proud space program. I have chosen to look forward and never back. I will try to figure out how to access this site when I get back home. I think that is enough for now. I wish all of you the best of luck and the happiest of lives. Enjoy the journey as much as the destination, because like me you may not reach the destination you had originally wanted. If you enjoy the journey then the destination becomes less important. Satisfaction and happiness come in many forms, and not always in the form we first thought was important. Sincerely your brother in this journey, Lee
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Lee
You make me realise that whatever little niggles and uncertainties I have in daily life...they are of zero consequence.
You were fortunate enough to find true love...which eludes many people for most of their lives.
Go in peace, you will live through this and emerge into the sunshine again.
Anything you need..just ask
David
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What a sad but beautiful story. You may not have ended up with the love you sought, but you have found a love none the less.
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Lee, thank you for your update , Sujuan and I can only wish the best for you and your new found family in China , regards Robert.
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best wishes
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it took me a little longer in the states than i expected. leaving tomorrow to return home. if some one knows how to access this site from china help me out and let me know. i am not real computer literate. i have arranged all my affairs and have fulfilled the Chinese governments requirements. I also have completed the united states governments requirements to work for a foreign government without loosing my citizenship in the process. I would advise not getting into that mess of paper work and interviews. they treat you like a traitor, and pry into absolutely every aspect of your life. I did not think it would be so intensive. I am happy it is done and i can go home now. my flight is at 7:30 tomorrow night pacific time. so please point me to how to access this site from china before that time. Thank you. Lee
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Hi Lee nice to hear from you again..
I use Mozilla Firfox and got online easy enough through that, when I was in Qingdao last November, maybe get in touch with Willy or Ted, they use some sort of Proxy I think...
Best of luck with your new life mate...
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The proxy is no longer needed since Irish changed the address. You should have no problem getting on here from China.
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no problems at all now getting on here in china
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Lee ,Have a safe trip back to China ,regards Sujuan and Robert .
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Jeez Lee and everyone concerned, just read your story! Got admire your tenacity and courage. I was very touched by your sad story and wish you success in your new home. It takes courage to do what you are embarking on. Funny how we find 'family' elsewhere. I am wondering if it is pretty standard for friends and relatives to treat us as if we are some kind of outcast if we look to find a Chinese wife? I haven't felt any real support from my family. Just scepticism. My mother thinks my learning Mandarin is just a flash in the pan. I'm 55 next week. You would think family would be happy that you are taking responsibility for your own happiness. It just makes me more determined to find a wonderful Chinese woman to marry. Don't know if this is the right thread to get feedback on this topic, but I'd like to know other guys experiences with family and their responses.
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Peter , not really surprised by your families thoughts as unless they have interacted with Chinese people in the past they still think of China as a backward country , not as a country where now all people are welcome to visit , the family group is still very important , it is safe in most places to wander around the streets and not get mugged , there are quite a few cities that have more than the whole population of Australia and whilst if you do meet a beautiful lady one can either relax and live in China or in Aussie land , a lot of the ladies are not looking for a ticket out , just honest love which they will return 10 fold , having been there quite a few times now , I have never had a drama and now as a family group we will be going back at xmas to Shenyang as Sujuan still has business interests there , but saying that she also through contacts started working here 1 week after arriving here in Jan2010 , but I did have to put my foot down and say only 5 days a week not 7 ha ha .
You will probably find your family will continue to be sceptics until you can show them photo's of you together and they can meet them via webcam , regards Sujuan and Robert .
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I just now read Lees story. Everything seemed to be perfect. Except his own familys approval.
This is a cruel story. But brings a teaching that no one really seems to understand early enough.
People don't realize how much their close ones or other things actually mean until they loose it. Or don't know how to appreciate it enough.
Even if I'm writing about this at the moment. I will only remember this for tonight. And then carry on with my life. Its just that every now and then I think about this. And then try to give people and things more value.
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Peter , not really surprised by your families thoughts as unless they have interacted with Chinese people in the past they still think of China as a backward country
I will also add to this that China is a communist country and therefore all the people must be bad or of that political persuasion and therefore can not be trusted. Well this is what a co-worker said to me when I explained about my upcoming trip last July. What a tosser, just show how ignorant some people can really be, or chose not to educate themselves on the world.
My family have spoken to Xia via Skype and can not wait to meet her in person. They accept her for who she is not where she comes from.
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i will add that my family especially my late mom met Sara online and really liked her. but they did object strongly to me
moving here because the thought of china being communist, the country is backwards compared to ours and probably
unsafe. i told them its safer here than in california. and some cities in the country are a little different but it is a nice
country and if it wasnt why was i coming here to live for 10 years for periods of 3 to 6 months. just a stigma that many
people have. this upcoming summer when my oldest son and his wife visit with the 4 kids will give them more feedback
as to were i live and china
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My 2 little girls 8 and 11 they just love my wife.
Well that was easy, So I guess that means the whole family loves her. And the people that don't like it, For me that's good reason to do it.
Daddy whats a communist? They are just a bunch of old hippies living together honey.
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I am doing fine, thank you for your concern. I am still living in China. I live in Chongqing and have a good job and a nice new apartment. Well new to me anyway. It has been a few months now and my Chinese mother is trying to introduce me to girls. I find this very strange, but I am part of the family so she wants me to be happy and have a wife. She is very cunning about it, she never just brings a girl to introduce to me. Instead she invites the mother over for dinner and The daughter comes along. So during my twice weekly dinner with them there is always a new girl for me to meet. The Chinese accept things and move on much faster than us in the west. Well at least faster than me.