China Romance
General Discussion and Useful Links => Newbies Corner => Topic started by: Paul Todd on November 29, 2010, 12:31:08 am
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I came across this and thought it might be useful,it's always interesting to see it from another point of view. It's from Linda Chen's Blog. She's a teacher working and living in SW China
I read an article by a blogger entitled “What do western males look for in a Chinese wife?” Here, I would like to stand at the other side and discuss, “What do Chinese women look for in a western husband?”
First, we Chinese women are attracted to western men’s strong build and charming appearance, say, big blue or hazel eyes, and straight nose. To most women, broad shoulders give them a sign of reliability. Besides, mix-blooded babes are a big PLUS, who are said to be, genetically speaking, healthier, prettier and smarter. Women, as I am included, fancy about having mix-blooded babes.
Then comes good manners of westerners’. I don’t know if it is still possessed nowadays by the majority of western men. At least, my late German boy friend was a man of good manners. He was always neat and had very good table manners. He also took all shopped groceries or our luggage when we went out for a tour. I was strong enough to take my portion, but such a feeling of being spoiled made me feel I was loved and cherished.
Thirdly, it is a good choice for romantically-minded Chinese women to have a western husband. Westerners are regarded as knowing better how to express love. They have diversified love languages. Generally speaking, people can speak love languages in the following ways: giving physical touch, encouraging words, heartfelt services, present and sharing quality time together. Each person may dominantly be touched by one or a combination of them. I am the one who is easily ignited by the first two ways. I love kisses, hugs, and caresses. And as far as I know, most western men are experts compared with their Chinese counterparts.
Fourthly, westerners are free from some nonsense of superstition. Chinese female divorcees or widows have already been under great social pressure. People are inclined to think there must be something wrong with them. What’s worse for widows, some men think they might bring them bad luck. Shortly after my beloved hubby passed away, there was a period that I thought the campus on which we live kept reminding me the past sweet memories and the present huge loss. That was unbearable for me and I just wanted to escape from the familiar surroundings. So I went back to Guangdong, in which I used to study and work. I called my former boss, who is the husband of my classmate, to check if he might help me to find a job there. Before I was very close to my classmate and her husband and even spent some nights at their home. To my dismay, the boss was so afraid of the possibility that people in my situation – newly widowed – would enter their house and bring them bad luck that he was as blunt as to tell me it would be proper that I went stay with my unmarried friend in her dormitory instead.
Fifthly, a western Christian male may become some Chinese women’s pursuit. A marriageable Chinese Christian male is hardly available. More and more Chinese convert to Christianity. But if you go check in a church in China, you will find the majority of church-goers are females or seniors.
There is also some other aspects in western husbands that attract Chinese women. On a whole, they are more keen on pursuing a healthy life style, say, they often go to gym for workout, they go for travel regularly, and they don’t need to go social by spend a great amount of time on dinner party which is usually associated with heavy alcohol-drinking or on mahjong which may demand them to lose money to the right person at right time in a tactful way.
Last but not the least, there is always a space for both western husbands and eastern wives to learn and to grow in their life journey. Uncertainty, or not having a shared cultural background, in a good sense, can bring about mutual attraction.
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Wonderful Paul !!! Thanks again for such great Post .. even if they're someone elses . I don't want to pad myself on the Back or lie , but I do see my Character in a couple Paragraphs here .
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Yes Great Post Paul-Never once did it mention money-cars or green cards-the things so many of us think.....we are about to be scammed out of.
If one is looking for a fresh start and a new life, one should start it with new outlook and a fresh slate. Thanks James
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Hello!Paul:Indeed, in China. Very superstitious. If you are widows. Go to other people's house is very unlucky.
The Chinese men moral is increasingly decline.(But not all men. There is also some good man.) They have no sense of responsibility. In outside seeking lover.Five thousand years of Chinese culture in them without a trace.Divorce rate increased year by year.We inherit the social and family dual pressures.We want to change a way of life.Although I don't know the future is good or bad.We can trust in god.We cannot lose confidence.Because the sun is still rising.
Tomorrow will continue.May the Lord is with us!(I don't know translation software is correct. If there are no correct place. Please forgive me.)
rachel :)
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Good points guy's,
I always knew you would be one of the guy's that carriers the shopping Arnold ;D .....me too!
I think we can sometimes get tied up in own own insecurities and misconceptions about China and the women here. Always feeling that we are about to be scammed or misled in some way. Always looking for that piece of the jigsaw that doesn't fit, so we can throw our hand up and shout foul play. While I'm not saying that there are not scam artists out there on both sides and we do need to take care, we should remember that the vast majority of people are looking for the same thing, love and companionship.
Rachel thank you for adding to this thread, I was hoping you would! You have a unique perspective on this, thanks for sharing with us. Please do not worry about your English skills,we understand exactly what you are saying! :)
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Great subject Paul, you did it again as always. I agree that men can get caught up in looking for a scam and many have lost a real gem in the process.
I think if one begins pursuing a woman through a dating site that initially they should be looking for a scam and should push to talking with her on a regular basis that she can agree to. After having a second or even third webcam visit the man should stop looking for a scam and really focus on building the relationship getting to know her. If there is a scam it will manifest itself.
I can't tell you the number of times as Peggy and I talked on the webcam and then afterwards I think she is scamming me that I would have to tell myself, "Shaun, if she were scamming you she is putting in way to much time in for a scam. She wouldn't have to have time to scam others." It is physically possible to do but very impractical. The major problems as I see it is that we are half way round the world and we can't see physically on a daily basis and then you throw culture and language differences in and there is a lot of doubt that can build in your mind.
Therefore a man should spend his time developing the relationship and stop looking for something that most like isn't there if they are webcaming regularly.
Also just because a Chinese woman has different goals that we thing they should does not mean they are scamming you. Take Peggy for instance one of her goals other than having a western husband is to own a house in China. It took me a long time to understand why. She equates not having a house in China as being poor and she does not like that feeling. I discovered in the process of getting to know her that she plans on working extra here in the US to achieve that goal. She at this point isn't asking me to buy it. I decided to make it a non issue and after she has lived here a while if she decides she doesn't want to own a house in China then it will be all the better for me anyway.
The point in all this I am saying is, don't invest your thoughts in looking for a scam after you have a woman on webcam on a regular basis. If it is a scam it will manifest itself in time.
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Your right Shaun.
I have met too many foreigners here who have SCAM SCAM SCAM embedded in there head. I met one person here who was so concerned that he may be scammed that he would not take a taxi anywhere unless someone else was paying for it that is!
Ok someone will tell you that something costs 100 rmb well you know you have to haggle down. Thats business not being scammed.
But if you stupid enough to send women women here before you met them then you deserve to be scammed.
The very vast majority of Chinese are honest. There are great penalties here if found they are crooked.
Willy
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Paul, i just got through reading the entire series of articles on that site.. Very good. thank you for the link. dan
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One other thing. Money does play a great part in a relationship regardless of what anyone will say.
There has been several instances of marriages breaking up where once the man's income has been cut off through illness or redundancy they have literally been ditched by the 'loving wife'. The woman want to know that their lives have improved, not stood still or gone backwards.
So make sure your income is secure before you embark on this fascinating journey.
Willy
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When I first moved over here my income was far from being secure and my wife knew and accepted this. I was confident in my ability to rise to the challenge and prove to be a worthy husband of this exceptional woman. I agree that money is important in a relationship but it is not everything. If you think that freeloading off your wife is acceptable, your in for a shock. When we marry it should be for better or worst, as we say rich or poor our love will endure. If my wife or I fall ill we know the other is always there for support and comfort. That is what a real relationship is, not some shallow excuse based on money. As we get older ill heath is bound to happen,many of us here are not youngsters anymore and if you think your wife is going to leave you in these circumstances then maybe something is seriously wrong in the first place.
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i think it's luck to meet a nice western like you for a chinese lady. the happy marriage over the world is the same: the husband is hunter in the family. he uses his money to support his family and makes his family have nice life. the wife should take care of the family nice and make his man feel very comfortable at home. she will support the family if she has a nice job.
i believ marriage is love, especially between the western and the chinese . loving each other could make them to understand, respect, trust, be honest and patient each other. they will get happy life.
i have a question to ask: how to make sure a western is nice husband before or after married?
sara
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Sara...
If there was always a correct answer to your question , then we all would be very happy !!!
There is a saying in English, I hope it translates OK for you:
"Past behaviour always predicts future performance"
What this means is that any person will mostly behave in the future as they have behaved in the past. If you want to know how your husband will behave in his future marriage to you, then find out as much as you can about how he behaved in his previous marriage....and keep your fingers crossed for luck...or Yuan Fen ;D ;D
David
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Sara,
What David tells you is true. I would like to add to that to see how the man treats his mother and sisters if he has any.
Unfortunately there isn't a set of rules to follow to guarantee success in this area. I can tell what I will avoid in a woman more that I can tell you what I need for compatibility.
You might look at the things that attracted you to your previous husband and avoid men who posses those things. From my own experience I am attracted to women that are simply not good for me so I have learned those characteristics and avoid them. Peggy isn't anything like my ex-wife thank God. I spent many hours thinking about these things before I began looking for another woman. Peggy has most all of the new set of qualities I looked for. For me it has made all of the difference.
Shaun
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I've lived my life believing most people are good people. I've never really been scammed that I know of. You do have to be more cautious when dealing with people on the internet, but there are ways of finding out if you are being scammed. No different than real life, just get to know the person, over time a scammer will easily reveal themselves.
I think its quite natural for any women to want security in their lives. They want to know they will have at least a decent life, if not a good life. I doubt it matters what the cultural background is. When I met my girlfriend I had some uncertainty in my life. I told I'd given up a good position so I could have more time to raise my kids. I also made sure I gave her comfort I'd always be able to earn enough to provide for my family and give us a good life. I think that's important for any lady.
Sara the comments made by David and Shaun are good ones. I agree with David, I don't think you can change a persons basic characteristics, so past behaviour has a lot to do with their future behaviour. As Shaun says, there are no guarantee's, so taking the time to get to know someone well is important. For me, I look to how they feel about family, how they treat their friends, how consistent their behaviour is, basic beliefs in what is right and what is wrong. If you can match those attributes, I think you've gone a long way to finding a great life partner.
Alan
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Davin
thanks, you said "Past behaviour always predicts future performance" is the same as a saying in Chinese: "You will know a person is nice or bad when he was 3 years old".
Shaun
you are right. i think i need to learn more from the past. i believe i treat the others' nice and they will treat me nice too in the past. but now i knew just most of people will do the same as mine. not all.
Alan
you said: "For me, I look to how they feel about family, how they treat their friends, how consistent their behaviour is, basic beliefs in what is right and what is wrong. " yes, i need to make sure his basic characteristics is the same as mine if i still have a chance to meet a nice man .
what you said let me make sure the nice husband in the west is the same as in the china: make money, take
care of his wife, family amd friends, respect, be honest.........
i have anothere question to ask: what is "the half and half in the marriage "in the west coutries?
thank for Davin, Shaun and Alan all again.
sara
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Not sure where the free loading off of wife's came from Paul. Maybe you have more experience in that field than me as either you missed my point or you just wanted to get something new into the discussion. And I was not talking about scams and scammer's. I was talking about the average Chinese women.
We probably all know where men have been supporting women and then lots their jobs and the women has gone - been some on here as well. Some women I know even moved away from their men when they realised that he was not going to improve their own position - some are already divorced.
To Chinese women MONEY IS the first consideration in a relationship, has he lots of money, has he prospects of earning good money, will he buy you a house? These are the first things that a women is asked by family and friends when she admits to going out with a foreigner.
But I agree with the fact that YOU should help one another through good and bad times, that is what being married is about but sometimes it does not work both ways. A marriage is for keeps, no two ways about it, but both Chinese wife's and foreign husband come into marriages 2nd or 3rd hand or even more with the attitude that if it don't work then I can soon end it. I say make a mistake and you should live with it.
Anyway I would say before you marry someone you should follow possibly Shaun and that of Irishman examples - get to know each other first. If you cannot spend a lot of time in China then make several visits.
Do not rush into a marriage within days of meeting each face to face for the first time. NO MATTER how much you talk by video cam, telephone or any other method. Get to know each other first and her to know you. Each talking in their own controlled environments is not the same as face to face.
I was in China was three months before I met my now wife. I spent another 5 months in China with her before we embarked on marriage. We knew each others good and bad points. I am buying a home here. Not for my wife but our home. (Mind you it will end up as hers, no doubt, as I hold a few less life years in credit than she.) But after being single for just over 60 years I wanted to be sure that I ever only had one wife in my life or should I say I only ever wanted to marry and have one wife.
I know my wife's history and I know that I am making a difference to her life, hopefully for the better!!!, as she has certainly made a difference to mine.
Willy
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Half and half........
I think Western men wish to share many things with wife. Discuss all things, agree with each other how to manage life together. Decide together what to do. Make plans together how to live happy life.
I think many Chinese men want to make most decisions by themself and wife will obey.
We call this "master/servant relationship"...or "patriarchy (sorry for big word, but it will translate OK )
Most Western Women will not allow Men to make all decisions, most Western men want to share all things with wife.
This is "half and half"...doing all things together....with pleasure and love.
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David
you said: "I think Western men wish to share many things with wife. Discuss all things, agree with each other how to manage life together. Decide together what to do. Make plans together how to live happy life.“ that means sharing everything with his wife and making their life better with a good plan the west countries? but somebody told me: "Half and half........" means the husband could use all his wife's money because she has a house and made money more than him, and he keep something secret from his wife.
Thank for being patient to me because i know i need to learn more and make my life better in the future.
sara
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Sara
The laws about shared money and houses are different in each Country.
But basically, what money and property husband and wife make TOGETHER must be shared between them.
What money and property a wife or husband has BEFORE they were married, can be kept seperate (that is Australian law)
If the marriage has produced children, then wife will get a very big share of ALL husbands money and property....this is a VERY different situation.
A husband cannot LEGALLY use his wife's money unless she agrees to it. he has no rights to take her money. She has no rights to take his money also !!
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Sara there are legal issues with how money and property are shared. To really know you would need to consult with a lawyer in the country you would reside in. More important I think is how the couple view these issues. It's something a couple should discuss as money often creates conflict in a marriage. When I was married my wife and I pooled everthing together. It didnt matter who earned it, it was there for both of us. We also shared all of the important decisions in our life. I think a lot of western men would do the same.
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i have a question to ask: how to make sure a western is nice husband before or after married?
sara
Obviously, communication is very important. Don't be afraid to ask tough (uncomfortable) questions, and don't accept simple answers. If something sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
Time together is probably more important. How he treats your family is a good indication, but how he treats the taxi driver or street vendor can sometimes reveal his true nature.
I have a question for you Sara: Why do you want to find a western husband?
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Now here's a subject I am well experienced in. I can only speak for myself but the "Half and Half" to me never works out right. Though I dated women that had or made more then me I never took advantage of it. I still paid for the dinners, etc. It's just not my nature to take. On the other hand I've had the opposite with women supposedly to be half and half and decide to put their money away and live off mine.
Sara, yes it is possible a man will take from a woman there are some like this but it depends on the man.
A good saying to remember is "You don't know the person until you live with them"
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Why do i want to find a western husband? this is ince question to me.
you know, i have a job and a nice family (my parients both retired and have a high salary in china), and i have had a house in gz over 10 years. i have travelled a lot in china. i just never travel out of china. i needn't have him to support me and my families' life after i met a western husband.
the saying in china: it's too old to learn. i think keeping to learn new could make my life happy and my brain young . and i love the defferent culture, eating, thoughts for each other.
i hope to learn more from the westean husband about the west countries' culture and the others because some of what i read about the west countries from internte are right, some are wrong.
i hope i could travel over the world after i retired with my west husband. maybe some people think travelling over the world needs a lot of money. but i don't think so you needn't much money to do it if you make the detail plan for travel first.
i was told: "you make more money and spend less, and i make less money and spend more so you need to give me money to use because we are a team." it is shame for a man if he did like that in china. How about thinking of his behavor in the west culture?
i have another question to ask: what do you think about the western if he never pay the bills of the restaurant with his lady's family and friends in china?
sara
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Sara if you meet a western guy that won't treat your friends and family to meals...find another guy. Gentleman pick up the bill!
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I agree. Sometimes it's hard to argue if others try to pay first. He should at least attempt to pay the bill.
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I have travelled to more than 40 countries in the world and if anyone thinks you can do that on little money from China then you are living in a dream world.
Many of these countries you cannot look for the cheapest hotels because if you do you are likely to end up in a problem neighbourhood. The USA and UK included.
Frankly many women I have met here expect too much from their men on many occasions.
If the husband falls on bad times the wife should help him both financially and with love. If the wife need help then the husband should do likewise. A couple should see each other through the hard times as well as the good.
Marriages are give and take wherever you are in the world. The only problem with Chinese marriage there is no mention of 'for richer for poorer for better or worse'. They seem to follow the Nigerian service where the words are 'for richer for richest for better for best'.
If you are only looking for a foreign husband so that you can travel oversea and live well then what happens to "love'?
Why not save up and do some traveling with organised groups. That way is becoming more and more popular in China as they often solve the visa problems.
Willy
Willy
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Willy
Would you read the book -" how to use 3000 dollars to travel over the word"? i think a lot of chinese poeple have 3000 dollars now include me.
sara
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Why don't you try it? It will give you an idea of just how difficult it is to live in the so called western world. But In think the title is so out of date. $3000 You need half of that to get to the USA. And you dont get cooking facilities in hotels you have to eat out and find food that agrees with you. Very pricey unless you go for the basic takeaways!
I have been all over the world except Australia and New Zealand and it has cost me a great deal more than that.
I have a book with the title 'Europe on a $1 a day'. But it is about 50 years old.
Willy
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A Husband and a Wife are a team.....or they should be !!
Before marriage, it is Western tradition for husband to pay for many things..dinner, theatre, movies and such.
After marriage, they are Team and who has money is not important...all is shared together.
Sara...if you a thinking for a marriage to a Western man where all your money and all his money is seperate...then you dont have a marriage, you have a Business Contract. !!!
If you love this Man, and he loves you, it does not matter if you are rich or poor, together you will make your life as good as possible. When you are together, it is NOT money that keeps a marriage strong, it is love, honour and compassion. If you or him have problems, together you can work them out well.
If you want a travel companion who will pay his own fare and you pay your own fare...that is OK...but dont have a marriage for this...have a friend only.
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To get an air fare to anywhere out of China will cost at least $1000
A hotel (not a backpacker doss-house) in any other country will cost at least $200 per day.
Food will cost $50 per day (at least)
So for $3000 you will get a 10 day holiday each year ONLY...and it will be a very low grade holiday.
If you want a Western Holiday and have a good standard and pleasant sightseeing and food, (plus air fare)....$3000 will last about 1 week.
My last holiday in Phuket at a 4 star hotel, for one person including air fare cost me $4700 Aus...and I enjoyed myself but I did not do many things which would have cost a lot more money (trips and excursions and hotel food)
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Hi Sara,
As others have said, the husband/boyfriend (doesn't matter whether they are from an eastern or western culture) should always attempt to pay (at the very least). It shows the respect your husband/boyfriend has for his girlfriend/wife and gives them face.
As for travelling the world on $3000, unfortunately that won't work. In many other forums you will see how hard it is. The problem is getting the visitor's visa. Many countries require chinese citizens to get a visitor's visa before they can enter. But to get that visa, you have to show that country that you will return back to China after entering the country. That is the hard part.
$3000 will give you the chance to visit one country depending on which country it is. Many will not require that much, but it is the minimum someone should have before they go visit another country.
David: $50 a day for food... depends on where you go. In Asia, that will get you a few days of food...at least for me it would...but that's why I like to eat where the locals eat (like hawker centres).... the food is generally better there.
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David
you are right. the marriage is loving each other in thier heart. and the honest for each other is important too in the marriage. what do you think about the marriage if the one told lies about his money, his past life?
what you said for holiday is normal travel that means you book the return tickets. if you have a chance to read that book you would know more skills for travelling because booking the round tickets might be much cheap, have free meal in the 5 star hotel, very cheap air tickets to another country........ what would happen if you have friends who live different countries. but the important thing is you need to have visa to the countries where you want to.
i have the dream of travelling over the world ( maybe just some countries ) after i read that book. i will try it after i retired. i think everyone should have a dream in the life although a lot of people's dream couldn't become true. that is life so i am here and learn more from you. thanks.
sara
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I have one suggestion for reducing the cost of travelling. Try a home exchange. I've done 3 trips where we swapped homes. We got to spend a week or two in a real neighbourhood, with a home roughly equivalent to ours at not cost. It is a great way to travel.
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Sara I have a friend who lives in Zhuhai.What she did was she went to a travel agent.And they took care of the visa's for her.She has ben to Australia New Zealand,And Japan.It was a packaged tour so she had to stay with the travel company.She told me she had a good time.Maybe you could look into this.When you are ready to travel.If you haven't found the man you are looking for by then
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Mustfocus
Yep...when I am in China I eat real well for a small fraction of $50 per day...but I love the local food and dont care if I never eat any Western food when I am in China. Some travellers cant stand the local food and are trapped into "expensive" Western diets that are not typical for their environment.
But if you are a Chinese person visiting a foreign country, you wont have your own usual food "on-tap" quite so easily. So you get more trapped into paying more for the specialised food you are used to, or eating the local food in restaraunts. $50 per day would only get you take-out junk food in Perth for instance. To eat good quaility food here...of any variety, we would expect to pay $50 per meal !!!
Ok, there are opportunities to eat for less in any country you visit...but gets a bit difficult if you dont know your way about !!
I guess what I am trying to say to Sara is that you can holiday on a shoe-string if you know how to go about it and are a seasoned traveller...but once a year "casual" tourism costs a bit more !!
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what do you think about the marriage if the one told lies about his money, his past life?
Sara
I dont know how to give you a good answer to this question. If there are lies about money and the past life....then maybe you did not find out enough about each other BEFORE you are married ?...it is too late to find these things AFTER marriage.
But if you truly love each other...you can sometimes forgive many things and begin a new life. If you cannot forgive...then it becomes divorce...I dont know any other answer to this problem.
By the way...5 star Hotels dont give free meals...only give breakfast free if that is included in your room rate.
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I have one suggestion for reducing the cost of travelling. Try a home exchange. I've done 3 trips where we swapped homes. We got to spend a week or two in a real neighbourhood, with a home roughly equivalent to ours at not cost. It is a great way to travel.
Have you tried finding one in China that you have done that with. Not sure that will work in a secure home in China though. How much would it cost to remove all the belongings from a home. Not many Chinese will leave belongings their whilst someone else is in their house without them. Chinese are very security conscious - not many burglaries take place by the homes are like fort Knox. Even balconies on tenth floors have security doors fitted to stop crooks who may climb up down the outside to them!!!
Willy
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Sara, I wish you every success in finding a decent man and fulfilling your ambition to travel. Everyone should have a dream! ;D
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Paul
thanks a lot from my heart. i fell you are nice guy from reading your comments. i came here and learn more. i will remeber it's too old to learn. i wlll keep learning from anywhere.
thank for all nice guys here.
sara
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I have one suggestion for reducing the cost of travelling. Try a home exchange. I've done 3 trips where we swapped homes. We got to spend a week or two in a real neighbourhood, with a home roughly equivalent to ours at not cost. It is a great way to travel.
Have you tried finding one in China that you have done that with. Not sure that will work in a secure home in China though. How much would it cost to remove all the belongings from a home. Not many Chinese will leave belongings their whilst someone else is in their house without them. Chinese are very security conscious - not many burglaries take place by the homes are like fort Knox. Even balconies on tenth floors have security doors fitted to stop crooks who may climb up down the outside to them!!!
No, I've only done it in North America. There are some homes in China on the website I use, but I havent tried it yet.
Willy
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Paul
thanks a lot from my heart. i fell you are nice guy from reading your comments. i came here and learn more. i will remeber it's too old to learn. i wlll keep learning from anywhere.
thank for all nice guys here.
sara
Maybe we should start a new thread on What Do Western Men look for in a Chinese Women. This may give the newcomer ladies a better insight.
But I guess Sara has learned one hard lesson and that is not to marry someone three days after meeting him face to face for the first time. Get to know each other first. Wait a month or two and probably she would not be in the position she is today.
Willy
Just one other point Sara. It does not help your case sending PMs that really annoy people and have half truths and inuendos