9/11

[Scottish_Rob]

Another year passes, another year missed by family, friends, people of the world...

9/11 so tragic.....Lest we forget...RIP

[Jimmy]

It was tragic.
I often wonder how long it will be until it is forgotten like many other dates that just as many other people died.
Like Dec 7.
It is unfortunate they all fade eventually.

[shaun]

This thread could get so political quickly so I'll give it a try and keep my politics at bay.

It dawned on me yesterday that 9/11 was a modern day Pearl Harbor.  Back in the day America rose up and swiftly punished those who dare to attack on American soil.  I hope the Japanese, if there are any on this site, are not offended my my statement. That is not what I am talking about.

In our current political climate I don't think anyone as President would be able to handle the kind of kick them in the ass approach that our earlier leaders did.

For a while we sing Kum-by-ah and hug each other and get somber about the attack.  Then once the official time of mourning has passed Americans get back to tearing down our own nation from within.

It's kind of sad when you think about it.

[ron]

I dont think it will ever be forgotten it will be a footnote in history as time passes by the people that saw it and experienced it will never forget it as well as the people that lost loved ones.But as time goes by and we get older the youngsters born today will only see it as a footnote such as Hiroshima and Pearl Harbor or even as world war 1 and 2

[Jimmy]

This thread could get so political quickly so I'll give it a try and keep my politics at bay.

It dawned on me yesterday that 9/11 was a modern day Pearl Harbor.  Back in the day America rose up and swiftly punished those who dare to attack on American soil.  I hope the Japanese, if there are any on this site, are not offended my my statement. That is not what I am talking about.

In our current political climate I don't think anyone as President would be able to handle the kind of kick them in the ass approach that our earlier leaders did.

For a while we sing Kum-by-ah and hug each other and get somber about the attack.  Then once the official time of mourning has passed Americans get back to tearing down our own nation from within.

It's kind of sad when you think about it.

Wow when I wrote what I did. That is exactly what I was thinking.
And you know when It comes to the killing. It's usually not the desire of all those doing it. Like good soldiers they do as they are told. It is the spineless heartless egotistical leaders. The don't have to see the blood or hear the screams. only give the order then go have dinner get up the next day and ask well how did we do?
It would never happen. but I always kind of thought instead of a war. Let these leaders bring 4 people with them to a site. No modern weapons only knives swords, stuff like that. Fight to the death. Last man standing his country wins.
They all get the violence they so desire. People die and it is the people that want a death most that get killed. And I am sure future leaders would think a little harder before they decided they wanted war.
It's easy to kill people when you have someone else to do it for you. But to do it with your own hands. I would venture to say most people couldn't do it.

I would agree with you the difficulty many have at killing with there own hands.
It seems that killing comes too easy to us as a species, especially when hate and justification are so easily mixed together.

I would agree with that. Makes a person wonder how long until humans are extinct.

[Rhonald]

Well Jimmy I can think of certain leaders that would be willing to negotiate as you suggested. In this scenario a smaller country could get ahead by challenging a more moderate country. Since many smaller dictatorships have corrupt leaders that I am sure have blooddied their hands, they would relish their chance to take on the more modern countries.

And for having no scruples..... I have heard and seen many Presidents and Prime Ministers in power seem to age quit quickly once in high office. I am sure the burden of power does not sit as easily for them as you suggest.

I would agree with you the difficulty many have at killing with there own hands, but then the amount of people who throw their lives away makes me second guess this. It seems that killing comes too easy to us as a species, especially when hate and justification are so easily mixed together.

[shaun]

Heard an interesting report on the radio this morning.  The US has been having problems with the Mexican border because of drug lords.  Now the drug traffickers are coming up to the border and firing guns at the US Border Patrol.  Our most wonderful President has told the Border Patrol to back up and not fire back at the drug trafficking criminals.  They can come across the border and shoot someone and get a free ticket back to Mexico to avoid prosecution.  Some of them come over and then stay.

The American government is allowing people from Mexico to come into the US illegally and then get their resident status.  Why then is it so difficult to bring a Chinese woman here?  It just doesn't makes sense.

[Martin]

Guys, remember that this is not a political forum.  While I understand the nature of this thread, especially with the September 11 anniversary this week, please be careful that this thread does not get to politicized.

[shaun]

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Martin this will be one of those threads that is extremely difficult not to get into political comments.  Please try to read it with a issue driven thought process.  On this issue it doesn't matter what side of the isle you find yourself politically it is an issue that needs to be dealt with in DC.

My frustration is that it is easy for the Mexican population to come here illegally but for a good Chinese woman it almost takes an act of congress.  I am not saying the Mexican people are not good people.  I know better.  I would like to see a little balance and get Peggy here a lot sooner.

[David E]

Thanks for letting this thread run Martin.....the issue of Migration, illegal or otherwise is always close to the surface when we begin the horrendous process of bringing our LEGAL Wife to our native Country.
The degrading process we all must go through is in some measure a reflection of the paranoia all Governments go through when they have you at their mercy.
We have much the same issues in AUS as many other Countries, where we are being overwhelmed by Illegal Immigrants who are brought here by professional people smugglers based mainly in Indonesia.
I dont have any problem with somone wanting to Migrate to a better place for the future prosperity of his/her family....I did it myself.....as did millions of people before me when they came to Aus legally....and surely, USA was built on the skills and application of millions of migrants.
The Illegal Migration issue is NOT Political, it is social. Only problem is that the process has been hijacked by beaurocracy and the extreme left wing minority in our society. Politicians simply refuse to do anything substantial to stop it.

I always puzzle that these people coming here via smugglers claim to be economic and/or Political refugees......but they have somehow managed to buy plane tickets from their homeland, wait in Indonesia for weeks or months for an opportunity and paid up to $5000 each to a smuggler for their passage to Aus........and they claim poverty !!!! On the trip from Indonesia to the remote North West of Aus, they destroy any documents they have and are put into a detention Centre (more like a 4 star hotel really) and wait about 6 months for a temporary visa.

Contrast this with our wives/fiances who also pay big money in fees to apply for fiance/spouse visa, wait up to 12 months, must go through interviews and produce mountains of documents before they can come here. And it is our responsibility, on pain of rejection to prove to these Beaurocrats that our relationship is genuine !!!
I have talked seriously to some high power Lawyers about my Constitutional right to marry who I wish and why should I be prevented from bringing her here immediately, because I have accepted the responsibility for her, financially, she will not be a burden on our system. The answer is that I sure can marry whoever I want to, within certain parameters, Government cant prevent it...but the Migration Act overrides any rights I may have Constitutionally to marry and live with my wife...how's that for Democracy at work !!!
Sadly, any system always works toward Entropy...the change from an ordered to a disordered state. (thats why a dropped egg never reconstitutes itself, or a pack of cards thrown into the air will never land in the exact order they were !!!)

The vast majority of people who look at the "Western" way of life and want a slice of it are just another small step in the descent to disorder that any natural system exhibits.....if uncontrolled migration is encouraged and allowed, then the dilution of our way of life is guaranteed. Most of these people are wanting to get away from their own Country because their own Government has been too venal, lazy, corrupt , incompetant...whatever, to provide them with a basic living standard...so they want a slice of our pie...I wonder if they will work as hard as we did for centuries to get where we are now...I think not.

Forgive my rantings...this subject makes my blood boil !!!!
David

[Martin]

I understand the nature of the thread, which is why it isn't closed...but I just didn't want too much politics.  The reason for that is, people tend to bash one specific country.

I agree with what you guys are saying.  We just had a boat arrive on the west coast with around 500 Tamil refugees.  They were headed for Aus initially, but then turned for Canada.  It pisses me off that they are here.  I am not against immigration...legal immigration.  I am also not against refugees.  Go to the closest Canadian Embassy (Or American, Aus, UK, etc), and ask for asylum.  David, you make a very valid point, about the costs involved for these people to make their way here.  A lot of money gets paid to smugglers to get to our countries.

The other thing that really irks me, is that over here, we have this Canadian Tamil Congress.  And they are trying to tell the Government here, what all they should be doing with these new "immigrants".  Give them housing, education...and of course, none of them are Tamil Tigers.  Another special interest group that will get their voices heard before anyone else.

[Rhonald]

When my wife was complaning about a bad tooth, ie: a cavity, I asked at my work if my benefits could extend to my wife in China. I was told that only once she came to Canada could I get her under the company plan. I didn't like the answer but I could understand their policy. Now when I hear that this boat load of suppose refugees are entitled to free dental care while their cases are processed.... well I know it is my tax money hard at work but hardly working for me.

I read a report that said in the past year 70% of Tamils who claimed refugee status had returned to their native country on vacation or to visit relatives. I can not knock them for using loop holes to try to find a better life but I do see our own government too afraid as to be perceived to the outside world as uncaring. It's easier for them to allow their own citizens to feel inept then to harm public opinion abroad.

[Vince G]

but they have somehow managed to buy plane tickets from their homeland, wait in Indonesia for weeks or months for an opportunity and paid up to $5000 each to a smuggler for their passage and they claim poverty !!

Same thing here with mostly cubians claiming they live in bad conditions with nothing like prisons? But then you see home vodeos of there conditions and in the background you see nice furniture, they have gold jewelry on and lets not forget the video camera they are using to show how poor they are? And the same for the smuggling 5 to 10 thousand a person? Such BS.